Has anyone seen tracked quads on trails? Should they be allowed?

What would be the effects?

Where would the rule changes end? Tracked Rhinos, Rangers, and Razors? Tracked trucks?

I know Sno-mans definition of a snowmobile, but what happens in the real world???[/b]

I've seen them in the Whiteshell. Other than being slow as shit, I don't see the issue unless some of you guys come up with something creative

 

I believe snoman says right in the "rules" no ATV's regardless of traction tool.

I'm of the beliefe you better have a pass to be on the trail, and technically a quad isn't valid to have a sticker...so end of story.

 

When you slam the throttle to the bar from a dead stop they make the same (if not more) damage as wheels. Also, when you get into the larger models, they occupy much more space (width wise) than a snowmobile.

If and when they allow them on the trails - I'm done with snowmobiling altogether

 

When you slam the throttle to the bar from a dead stop they make the same (if not more) damage as wheels. Also, when you get into the larger models, they occupy much more space (width wise) than a snowmobile.

If and when they allow them on the trails - I'm done with snowmobiling altogether [/b]

They also don't make the same imprint as a sled and cause a rough trail, and can make it dangerous if you like to ride a little fast.(just waiting to get feedback on this)

Tires on the trail...those guys should be pulled off and tossed in the bush, you want to ride your quad in the winter...find somewhere else to ride it.

 

I have to agree with you guys. We were on our annual trip a few years back on some fresh groomed trails it was great. Then as we got near the whiteshell we ran into some nasty quad ruts that snaked back and forth. We had to crawl the rest of the way it sucked. I don't ride trails much but I buy a pass every year to support the clubs so that they are there. I would support the quad riders if they had their own trail system or if they could go on the sled trails without making them dangerous and paid the same money that we do.

I really don't know what the tracks do to the trails but my opinion would be based on the damage they cause. If they cause the same damage as a sled, then buy a pass and keep to the right, if they destroy the trails please stay off!!

 

FWIW, I haven't noticed the damage a tracked quad makes. I can't see how they can be any worse than a sled when they're on a groomed trail. I've followed a couple in the Whiteshell before and didn't notice anything out of the ordinary other than them being slow. On the lake it's a different story.

 

FWIW, I haven't noticed the damage a tracked quad makes. I can't see how they can be any worse than a sled when they're on a groomed trail. I've followed a couple in the Whiteshell before and didn't notice anything out of the ordinary other than them being slow. On the lake it's a different story.[/b]

Well hell, if they don't wreck the trails with tracks on let them buy passes and fill their boots.

 

Well hell, if they don't wreck the trails with tracks on let them buy passes and fill their boots.[/b]

What if met a quad on a tight trail?

Winch cables across the trail?

Do you think it would stop with quads? UTV's? Seriously, a 5 1/2 foot or 6' wide utv would be the next think on the trail...

 

What if met a quad on a tight trail?

Winch cables across the trail?

Do you think it would stop with quads? UTV's? Seriously, a 5 1/2 foot or 6' wide utv would be the next think on the trail...[/b]

Well if they go that slow I am thinking meeting them on a tight trail should be less stressful than meeting a sled going faster. Not sure how much wider a tracked quad is than one with wheels but my tires are what 43-45" wide? Less than my sled... Same with following a "slow" tracked quad, don't you pass slower sledders when you come upon them? I've seen tire tracks on trails but never had any difficulty with the ruts. I am new to the trails and have seen only limited examples but it seems a bit blown out of proportion. I would sooner meet tracked quad than a nut job on a sled. The tracked quads I have seen in snow had no effect on anything packed, only powder, so I would say damage to the trail is a myth. Winch cable across the trail... I don't see that you would be driving over your vision so the logical thing to do would be to stop and assist with the stuck machine. Same as the tracked quad would do if he came along your stuck snowmobile off a corner you couldn't make because of the nut job on the sled you met on it...

 

Keep them off the sled trails!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Get your own friggin trail system. With the huge cash they spend on big cc quads and tracks they can afford to buy a sled or pay to develop a club system and trails of their own. Which I imagine would be quite difficult seeing that most private land owners would rather shoot them than allow them on their land. Which brings up the reason that I don't want them on sled trails..... land owners would shut down our sled trails in a heartbeat. Oh, by the way I own a quad too.

 

well i must be one of the asses you guys hate on the trails, rode my quad on them at the end of last season, along with the rest of our group of 12 or more riders. there is no ban keeping them off the trails, and snowman will not allow us to buy a pass. go figure. too bad so sad. we will be seeing you guys out on the trails again this year, especially if the price of gas keeps going up!! i do ride my sled on the trails also and do have a pass.

for the guy worried about the winch cable across the trail, like really, if you are going so fast to miss seeing 2 or more quads on the trail, with a couple or more guys on the trail, then maybe you deserve to hit it, it would make the trails a safer place for all if you are driving so fast or just have tunnel vision! what happens when you come upon a dog sled or skiers, or even a person walking or dead sled on the trail? maybe an animal, will you run into them?

a quad most likely do less damage to a trail (unless it is soft) then someone with a 150hp or larger sled from a dead stop when they nail it, or even in a corner, a quad will not push out the corner like someone driving a sled aggressively will, and even taking off from a corner a quad will not rip it up as bad as a guy on the hammer on a sled will!! it just does not have the power. they will make a mess yes but so do sleds!.

get used to it guys, a lot more families are buying quads opposed to sleds as AFFORDABLE year round recreation vehicles opposed to something that we can only use down here for what, 2-3 months? with grooming for maybe 1.5-2 months?

 

I'm of the beliefe you better have a pass to be on the trail, and technically a quad isn't valid to have a sticker...so end of story.[/b]

so the trappers have to stay off? how about ice fisherman using the trail as a direct route to the lake? dogsleds? maybe they should be off but it is a public trail! how about people walking, do they need a pass?

 

They also don't make the same imprint as a sled and cause a rough trail, and can make it dangerous if you like to ride a little fast.(just waiting to get feedback on this)[/b]

isn't there a speed limit on the trails, something like 60kph or 80 kph? same laws on the road also, stay to the right, not cut to the inside of the corner cause your going to fast!

besides, how fast can your formula dlx go anyways? topped out at 90 kph?

 

What if met a quad on a tight trail?

Winch cables across the trail?

Do you think it would stop with quads? UTV's? Seriously, a 5 1/2 foot or 6' wide utv would be the next think on the trail...[/b]

What if met a quad on a tight trail?

no different then meeting another sled, groomer, person, animal, or dogsled which cannot stop or turn!

Winch cables across the trail?

if you can,t see the quads or people and slow down, well then you should not be driving anything then!!

Do you think it would stop with quads? UTV's? Seriously, a 5 1/2 foot or 6' wide utv would be the next think on the trail...

just a little exaggerated i would say!!

 

Keep them off the sled trails!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Get your own friggin trail system. With the huge cash they spend on big cc quads and tracks they can afford to buy a sled or pay to develop a club system and trails of their own. Which I imagine would be quite difficult seeing that most private land owners would rather shoot them than allow them on their land. Which brings up the reason that I don't want them on sled trails..... land owners would shut down our sled trails in a heartbeat. Oh, by the way I own a quad too.[/b]

if snoman or snowmobile clubs wish to continue, they are soon going to have to accept atv's into their membership just to survive financially. how much driving do you think a family with 2 or 3 sleds can afford to do this year? are they going to give up the sport? maybe buy a pass, or god forbid, maybe chance it and drive without a pass? maybe they will make a fake one, which i know guys do. how many miles or even times groomed do you think the clubs will be able to afford this year with the price of fuel? not much i would say.

the only way will be to combine the 2 groups, take the huge amount of money atvers will hopefully contribute and maintain the trails in summer and winter? summer maintainace would be what, run the trails once or twice a season to clear away trees which may have fallen ac across the trails after a storm? and once in the fall either before freeze up or just after to smooth down the ruts left in wet areas!

it would be a win win situation. but if both groups keep fighting, we will all lose.

 

I would honestly never buy another pass if they gave the go ahead to atv'ers in the winter with tires, and unfortunately most summer trails run across a lot of private land, and or crown land that is fenced for the spring/fall season and with cattle on it, which brings a whole other sit of liable probs to the table.

I like the idea of atv's having a voice, but it can't affect the other system in a negative way.

 

1. Interesting that owning a quad qualifies one use the "groomed snowmobile trail system" supported by a sport which has developed the trail system to what it is today. The way I look at this is, if you want to use this "groomed snowmobile trail system", then the quad owners should approach Snoman and the Province to be able to make a proposal about using the trail system. Or, developing a partially separate system - take a look out east to see what can be done. For an $95.00 ATV Trail pass when you register (cough, cough) your ATV, an ATV system can be developed to everyone's liking.

2. Having been an ATV rider for numerous years (since 1989}, ATV's wreck the shit out of the trails. Let me think - you pin the throttle = big ruts. A little bit of fish-tailing. A few donuts. Give me a break - the tires tear the shit out of the trails in the spring, summer, and fall. And with 4 wheel drive - Yee Ha!! - more ruts. Fixing this on the "groomed snowmobile trail system" will require more grooming than for the sleds. Hey, ATV's are fun, having run a Sportsman 700, Predator, Xplorer 400, etc. over the years - sand pits, trails. 40 miles out, then 40 miles back (if you don't carry extra gas).

3. Cost - hell, both can be expensive (lets see, ATV w/s, thumb warmers, hand warmers, track kits, warm clothing, maybe a ski kit for the winter - Wait - its a SLED) - its the choice we make. Both are seasonal sports, with ATV's actually having the longest possible season depending on the depth of the WATER - maybe April to end of November. If you want range - you can't beat a sled. Ride from the 59'r to where? LDB, Nopiming, Pine Falls, Gimli, Hecla, Portage - and back. Sleds were developed to run MILES - ATV's were developed based on HOURS of use. Yeah, there are some who put a lot of miles on their ATV's, but they are a minority. Ride an ATV from the 59'r to where? How fast? 10, 12, 15 miles per HOUR in the ditch?

4. ATV sales are declining. Yes, dealers are still selling them, but not in the numbers they claim. Along with boats, the consumer is cutting out recreation vehicles. If they stop sledding, they are not about to get into ATV's at this time.

5. For Snoman and the Snow clubs to continue to exist, its time for the Snowmobilers who use "groomed snowmobile trail system" to ante up the $95.00 for the pass - for starters. 10 rides for 9.50 a ride is not much for the distance you can travel. Yep - Pass fee with your registration. I rode when there where very few trails - ditches, the roller coasters in the Belair forest, ducking low hanging tree branches, etc -- I'll ante up the $95.00 for the pass.

So, in a nutshell - no ATV's on the Snowmobile trails. I can wait until its reasonably dry to ride ATV between April and November, on what was the sled trail. Then sledding when the season's ready.

 

I have no problem with them as long as they pay for a snopass. ATV's with wheels on trails pisses me off, I tried to drive up on one last year on 44 and kick him in the leg or something, but it was a kid, parents were on sleds behind them.

 

I crown land that is fenced for the spring/fall season and with cattle on it, which brings a whole other sit of liable probs to the table.

you can legally cross it as long as you close the gates. it is only leased public land, not private land. this would fall under the same law as running down a powerline crossing a farmers property, their has to be a gate under the powerline which allows people through, it must not be locked, you have to stay within hydro property which falls something like 50 yards from the edge of the towers? even if there is a crop planted you can run down it without any issues, but hopefully common sense will prevail in this circumstance!! we own property under a powerline right of way and we have to abide by the law.

 

I have no problem with them as long as they pay for a snopass. ATV's with wheels on trails pisses me off, I tried to drive up on one last year on 44 and kick him in the leg or something, but it was a kid, parents were on sleds behind them.[/b]

i would like to se you drive up on me and try to kick me, you would have a whole lot of other issues to deal with then just an atv pissing you off! i can promise you that!!

 

WOW this thread is really making me glad I don't ride the trails much.

 

i would like to se you drive up on me and try to kick me, you would have a whole lot of other issues to deal with then just an atv pissing you off! i can promise you that!![/b]

LOL ....I dunno...Delgaty is a pretty big boy, not so sure I would kick him back :yelrotflmao:

Honestly, it's just selfish of anyone on an atv on the winter trails to think their not affecting anyone, and not to mention thier breaking the law anyway, so they have no grounds for when us sledders bitch. I have a quad and use it quite a bit now in the summer, possibly getting close to using it more then my sled, but when the snow flies it hits the shed and the sled comes out, and I have to deal with enough atv ruts when the snow is shallow, little own when they can finally groom the trail over them.

 

LOL ....I dunno...Delgaty is a pretty big boy, not so sure I would kick him back :yelrotflmao:

Honestly, it's just selfish of anyone on an atv on the winter trails to think their not affecting anyone, and not to mention thier breaking the law anyway, so they have no grounds for when us sledders bitch. I have a quad and use it quite a bit now in the summer, possibly getting close to using it more then my sled, but when the snow flies it hits the shed and the sled comes out, and I have to deal with enough atv ruts when the snow is shallow, little own when they can finally groom the trail over them.[/b]

Guys,

Don't get mad at me playing devil's advocate. I'm trying to get information from the snowmobiling community to see what the implications would be. This is a real possibility for our sport.

Up here on the north side of the Ducks, we haven't seen many, if any, quads with tracks on the trail. But I've heard it occurs in the Whiteshell.

In terms of the winch cable, it could be a possibility, but probably not all that likely. Hey, I've heard of tow trucks doing the same thing on highways. The results were not pretty.

Growing into UTV with tracks... I can really see this happening. UTV's are gaining marketshare and popularity in the states like crazy. The are more family friendly, and have tons of options. Opening the trails to tracked quads would only make it easier to start allowing UTVs. Remember the side by side Bombardier sled from a couple years back. It'd be the same thing except for no skis on the front and a bunch more weight.

 

You tried to kick someone for riding on the trails?

I don't give a shit how much of a "big boy" you are, that just makes you a bigger asshole.

 

ATV's rip everything to shit, and to say tracks will tread lighter is bullshit. Like said before they can pay like the rest of us, but the trail system needs to be seprate. All the ruts on top of woops on our trails would make a mess, think about it...