Hardcore Sledder banner
1 - 20 of 45 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
12,019 Posts
button
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,455 Posts
Roller. It responds quicker and if you know how to tune it, a roller can do anything a button can do and some things a button cant.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
489 Posts
Button- Best upshift
Roller- Best backshift
But both can be tuned to do both well.
I prefer the button as a drag racer.
Where snowxrs prefer the roller.
With my 07 sled I am in the process of polishing my roller knowledge.

Just my .02
Mark
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17,181 Posts
Button- Best upshift
Roller- Best backshift
But both can be tuned to do both well.
I prefer the button as a drag racer.
Where snowxrs prefer the roller.[/b]
IMO:
Biggest pro of the roller is less friction - easier to get very good backshift while still having good upshift.

Biggest drawback of the rollers is that they use a compression-only spring to be compatible w/ electric reverse. this means that they need stiffer springs, which in turn hurts top end and makes more heat.

Usually easier to get good top end on a button.
And tuning components are cheaper for the button.

Myself, I'm sticking with the roller for now. Mostly because of thats what I'm familiar with, IMO easier to work on and I already have a selection of springs and helixes to juggle around in the 4 sleds in the stable.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,815 Posts
let me know what you think? is a button better or is a roller clutch better?[/b]
This will probably open a can of worms. I have TEAM rollers on all of my sleds and would not go back to a button - don't see the need to. I've run them for a few years as well.

Friend of mine has tested a TEAM roller for many years and has had them on every sled he's owned. He has raced many guys with the same sled with button setups and he has yet to find someone that can setup a button clutch to match or get beat by someone that had a well setup button.

I'm not saying that they can't be made to run as well and I'm not saying the button is inferior......just saying that when setup properly, a roller clutch (TEAM) WILL upshift everbit as fast as a button and it will backshift better as well.

Run whatever you are comfortable with, but the TEAM springs are cheap.....pretty much down to the same price as any torsional button spring and the helixes are WAY down in price as well. The TEAM rollers are not going anywhere anytime soon, so may as well get familiar with them.

FWIW, my sleds don't eat belts either, nor is heat an issue.

Hope it helps....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17,181 Posts
Myself, I'm sticking with the <strike>roller</strike> button for now. Mostly because of thats what I'm familiar with, IMO easier to work on and I already have a selection of springs and helixes to juggle around in the 4 sleds in the stable.[/b]
should be sticking with the button.

good point from sixpack re: parts, I guess it will be harder to find parts for the button , as the new sleds all use the team.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
148 Posts
fact or fiction does a roller clutch have less top end!!!!!!!!! true of false!!!!![/b]
Like any clutch, it will depend on the setup. However, does a roller clutch have less top end pull because it is a roller, no. Some think so but it is mostly because they have tried helixes with too small a finish angle. Button helix angles do not equate to roller helix angles and that confusion has led to some bad setups.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,815 Posts
Like any clutch, it will depend on the setup. However, does a roller clutch have less top end pull because it is a roller, no. Some think so but it is mostly because they have tried helixes with too small a finish angle. Button helix angles do not equate to roller helix angles and that confusion has led to some bad setups.[/b]
Well put, Mike. Any clutch can be made to run poorly.....making them run great is a little more difficult.

A gentleman on her not too long ago (pardon me, but I dont' remember his name...) did back to back tests using numerous roller clutches including a paragon, team, Polaris roller and button and did actual radar runsw with them all. I can't provide you definative numbers, but the conclusion was that regardless of clutch that was tried, the topend of each remained near equal, but advantage going to the rollers for backshift characteristics.

I wish I could remember his handle name.........
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
942 Posts
Well put, Mike. Any clutch can be made to run poorly.....making them run great is a little more difficult.

A gentleman on her not too long ago (pardon me, but I dont' remember his name...) did back to back tests using numerous roller clutches including a paragon, team, Polaris roller and button and did actual radar runsw with them all. I can't provide you definative numbers, but the conclusion was that regardless of clutch that was tried, the topend of each remained near equal, but advantage going to the rollers for backshift characteristics.

I wish I could remember his handle name.........[/b]
Has anyone compared the Arctic Cat roller to the Team roller. I ran the AC roller on my AC sleds and had very good luck. I have only had my Team off my Poo twice and cant recall if it is a straight bolt on. What does it take to put a AC roller on a Poo?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,815 Posts
Has anyone compared the Arctic Cat roller to the Team roller. I ran the AC roller on my AC sleds and had very good luck. I have only had my Team off my Poo twice and cant recall if it is a straight bolt on. What does it take to put a AC roller on a Poo?[/b]
I think it was pretty much bolt on if you had the keyed jackshaft. It got tricky when they started running splined shafts and such. Worse part was finding where to start with spring and helix. Helixes are also cheap and plentiful. I've heard of great results with a cat clutch, and if ya have a pile of springs and helixes for em', then give er.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
489 Posts
I do not have scientific facts on this, but to get a good start on converting button angles to roller angles.
Add 13 degrees to the angles of your current or favorite button clutch helix.
Im pretty sure this is close on the ac torsion spring roller, as far as the team goes I would guess it still would get you in the ball park.

Mark
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17,181 Posts
I think the angles will also depend on the helix diameter.
(At least thats what I read in Snowtech a few years back...)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
663 Posts
My experience is that a TEAM roller is a better choice for trail riding due to the improved backshift. However I have found the Polaris button clutch to be more reliable. I am very dissapointed with the TEAM clutch in respect to expected service life (5000 miles and mine is completely worn out). I am told this is normal and just replace the clutch :hmm: Bushings so worn I was toasting a belt every 100 miles!!! If the Polaris button clutch would work with Electronic Reverse it would be on my sled.

Oh and by the way... I remove, dissassemble, clean, inspect, and align both clutches at 500 - 1000 miles. Offset @ 5/8" and side clearance .15-.20 thou.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
12,019 Posts
Everyone says the team backshifts faster, which it does.

Problem I saw that a quick backshift also led to a slow upshift, which then lost sled lenghths against my buddies sled.

I started putting a few different helixs in the team and got it to accelerat just as fast as a button. This was using a F style or full shift helix. Problem is now it backshifted just like the button. Which I am not complaining about because it was very good anyways.

So if backshifting is the great importance with a loss for acceleration is what you want the team is better.

Or take your button and go 1 hole tighter on the secondary and you achieve the same thing for $0

I did a lot of tuning, I found the only thing a team is good for is Perc, thats why I have to run the team.

If it wasn't for perc, a button would still be on my sled.

So do the test, race your buddy with a well tuned button, then put a team in with a helix that makes it backshift better and see how much distance you loose in the midrange.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
12,019 Posts
To add, a team uses 2 rollers, very bad design, the helix is constantlly binding because of only 2 points of contact.

Take a plate out of the kitchen and balance with 2 fingers, then try 3 fingers.

Derlin washers, another fix for bad design of the spring binding in the cup.

The team uses 1 bolt to adjust sheve distance, another bad design as it puts pressure one 1 point and really binds. This can be felt while going real slow on blactop or conditions that make the carbide sdig in. You will feel the sled lurch.
 
1 - 20 of 45 Posts
Top