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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
OFSC permit: $180can speedlimit: 30mph
MICHIGAN permit: $36can Speedlimit(?) 55mph+

******I am not bitching, just pointing out a fact****

all I can say is, bend over boys. oh you need to fill up your sled with premium, here let me get that for you :augen41: ------> just to point out gas is normally about 20-25 cents cheaper there per litre...Why are we paying road taxes for places we can't ride on!? if that 50cents/ litre (guess?) went to the ofsc, we'd be alot better of! thats about 20$/tank of gas right to snowmobile clubs! (assumption 10 gal/~42L tank).
On another note, sledding is getting more and more expensive, and fewer and fewer people are riding. Bad for the sport obviously. and yet every time I look around here, some smartass is going " If you can't afford it, don't ride" while to a certain point this is understandable, eventually its having a negative impact on our sport. You'd think it be better if we had way more riders and 1/2 the cost per permit. I realize the OFSC has significant costs in respect to grooming and such <<time to lobby for gov't $$$>> , I believe one of the main points for the OFSC should be to get more people involved, and get a uniform way of thinking. Yet it hasn't been able to do that. I'm nto saying I have all the answers. but you look at issues that come up on trails, we battle each other, and the greenies/oldies get the best of us and we get screwed. like this speed limit thing.

I know this is all random, I just want to get some things on the table. lets get some other thoughts here. :dunno:
cheers!
 

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It's true that our 50 kph speed limit is archaic. Too bad it's so embedded now as it was established back when sleds could barely turn and had useless brakes. And bush trails were barely wide enough to pass through.
Today's sleds are 1000% better than the relics riden back in the 60's when 50 kph was fast, for the conditions.
With the insurance issues Ontario snowmobiling is struggling with I dought you'll see the government raise our speed limit any time soon, or ever.

So we'll have to continue to "roll the dice" and ride.
 

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Yep I hear ya!
My neighbours USED to come up to the cottage 4-6 times a year, had two sleds & bought two passes. They then went to a two-up sled & bought one pass! But at $180 for 4-6 rides a winter! They now buy NO passes & ride around the lake spending more time fishin!
 

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Originally posted by kneedeepinsnow@Oct 5 2005, 10:44 PM
OFSC permit: $180can                        speedlimit: 30mph
MICHIGAN permit: $36can                      Speedlimit(?) 55mph+

******I am not bitching, just pointing out a fact****

all I can say is, bend over boys. oh you need to fill up your sled with premium, here let me get that for you :augen41:  ------> just to point out gas is normally about 20-25 cents cheaper there per litre...Why are we paying road taxes for places we can't ride on!? if that 50cents/ litre (guess?) went to the ofsc, we'd be alot better of! thats about 20$/tank of gas right to snowmobile clubs! (assumption 10 gal/~42L tank).
On another note, sledding is getting more and more expensive, and fewer and fewer people are riding. Bad for the sport obviously. and yet every time I look around here, some smartass is going " If you can't afford it, don't ride" while to a certain point this is understandable, eventually its having a negative impact on our sport. You'd think it be better if we had way more riders and 1/2 the cost per permit. I realize the OFSC has significant costs in respect to grooming and such <<time to lobby for gov't $$$>> , I believe one of the main points for the OFSC should be to get more people involved, and get a uniform way of thinking. Yet it hasn't been able to do that. I'm nto saying I have all the answers. but you look at issues that come up on trails, we battle each other, and the greenies/oldies get the best of us and we get screwed. like this speed limit thing.

I know this is all random, I just want to get some things on the table. lets get some other thoughts here.  :dunno:
cheers!
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I will guess that the difference in the trail pass price is more than made up with the increased quality and quantity of our trails.

In addition you are WAY off on your gas comparison.

Gas in Ontario at $1.05 a litre works out to $3.97 Cdn at Gallon. With the strength of the Cdn $ that actually costs about $3.33 US. With gas pushing $3.00 a gallon in the US the difference is less than 10 cents a litre.

However, - I do agree that increasing costs are driving the "recreational" sledder out of the sport - which is a bad thing!
 

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Nate you are lucky as you live in the Soo

It is what a half drive to get to the trail in Michigan

That might be the better deal for you

But the vast majority of us do not live that close to the UP

That speeding ticket really got you frazzed EH :)

That has more to do with the OPP or SSMP and not the OFSC

And the fact that we have idiots missing corners and getting hurt,thus NO way of raising speed limits

And yes price are going to drive out the core volunteer and family riders who are occasional riders and not hardcore tourer who will ride no matter the cost of fuel or permit
 

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Not really worth talking about as this sport is quickly becoming a memory of better times. Hang in as long as you can and enjoy what we have today as I can see things coming to an end. There will always be riders out there that will pay any price but they will be few and far in between.
 

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We can't blame the OFSC for the high price of trail passes, we need to blame the insurance companies. As the vast majority of our trail pass $$ goes towards that.

And you know what? Raising the speed limit would only increase the price more!

As far as I'm concerned, 50KM/H is more than enough on the trails. Perhasp where you live it's nothing but railbeds and such (Which I hate because lunatics fly by me without regard to the speed limit anyway). In the kawarthas there are a ton of tight, twisty trails where a wrong turn equals wrapping yourself around a tree. 50KM/H is hard to accomplish at times - and yet tight twisty, technical trails are my fav to ride!

Don't get me wrong, I love opening up my sled as much as the next guy, but there's a place & time for it (aka: the lake). I've had too many close calls on tight trails with morons going way too fast. Besides, the speed limits aren't strictly enforced, but we do know that the OPP is out every now and then, and with that in the back of people's heads it tends to keep speeds under 70.. (kinda like the 401... 100 max but everyone's doing 120).

My 2cents.
B
 

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I said once on this site and I'll say it again. If anyone whines about $230.00 for the price of a permit to ride to the caliber of trails ontario has to offer i say go to Mich. and ride their $5.00 trail system. Don't forget your back brace and what ever you do don't let anyone you love lead or they will get hit. Traffic is retarded over there. :banghead:
 
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I like our trails here in the Sudbury area they are awesome, usually groomed well and virtually empty even on week ends. $180.00 is a good deal for all that a stones throw from my house. I think everyone should have to sign a waiver and the ofsc should not have to carry insurance at all except on the groomers ,I don't see the province insuring the roads we drive on,never heard of a law suit against the province when an acident occurs due to black ice because they did't get the salt down in time. The province has the ability to pass legislation to place limits on the liability incurred by the ofsc and private land owners who let us drive across their property as well as volunteers. I think the insurance co. has it's hands deep enough in my pocket already. Furthermore look at QC the price of the trail pass includes your liability portion of your insurance, all for less than we pay. This is what can be done with forward thinking not ass backwards tree hugging moron politicians we have here that think there is only one city in Ontario that being Toronto.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
well said guys, And yeah i agree that its the opp, and the insurance that screw every thing up. I will probably get a trail pass on both sides this winter for my sled, and i will be looking to get involed in the club a bit (maybe then i can pull some strings too). Freeze, yeah it just pisses me off cause I'm always more than safe, and they come bug me about dumb things in the middle of the week. Well i'm not stopping next time. ahh well.
 

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Originally posted by nAVEL@Oct 6 2005, 03:40 PM
As far as I'm concerned, 50KM/H is more than enough on the trails. Perhasp where you live it's nothing but railbeds and such (Which I hate because lunatics fly by me without regard to the speed limit anyway). In the kawarthas there are a ton of tight, twisty trails where a wrong turn equals wrapping yourself around a tree. 50KM/H is hard to accomplish at times - and yet tight twisty, technical trails are my fav to ride!

Don't get me wrong, I love opening up my sled as much as the next guy, but there's a place & time for it (aka: the lake). I've had too many close calls on tight trails with morons going way too fast. Besides, the speed limits aren't strictly enforced, but we do know that the OPP is out every now and then, and with that in the back of people's heads it tends to keep speeds under 70.. (kinda like the 401... 100 max but everyone's doing 120).

My 2cents.
B
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I think the OPP should sit on some of those tight corners & ticket the guys charging around on the wrong side of the trail & leave the speed limits alone!
Instead they sit on a 2 mile open straight hidden behind a bank & nail you driving even though your on a safe section where you can see for a long ways!
 

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Well worth the money..and still inexpensive compared to many hobbies..talk to anyone who races...now thats expensive!! It's a lot better when people post about positive things, but then again, some peoples glasses are half empty and not half full...
 

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Originally posted by Senior@Oct 7 2005, 09:02 AM
Instead they sit on a 2 mile open straight hidden behind a bank & nail you driving  even though your on a safe section where you can see for a long ways!
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I do not like getting a ticket either but when I do it usually is may own damn fault. The cops sit on the straights because it's easy for them and saver for everybody. I would hope that they are not around a blind corner with someone pulled over blockong the trail! :
 

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Originally posted by longspur@Oct 6 2005, 03:32 PM
Not really worth talking about as this sport is quickly becoming a memory of better times. Hang in as long as you can and enjoy what we have today as I can see things coming to an end. There will always be riders out there that will pay any price but they will be few and far in between.
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Amen!
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I think its a matter of the glass being full, and the wallet being empty.
either that or the glass is full to begin with, and then the government bureaucracies come in and tax the F**k out of ya every chance they that when the glass is half full... lol

it is not to ask why is the glass half full, but more important to ask how it got that way, and how i can keep it full, without having to put a "lid" on it and not being able to enjoy it because there is now a barrier between things. :beer:
that my philosphy TOTD :div20:
 

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I'd hate to see it but if ridership continues to decline as it has over the past couple winters the OFSC won't have enough revenue for the big insurance premium, never mind diesel for the groomers.
It's great riding a 300 mile day and seeing hardly a soul aside from your own group but you've also got to know that the OFSC/clubs can't last long in that situation. :banghead:
 

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You can't fairly compare a state run organization (Michigan) with a volunteer run non profit organization (Ontario). Each juristiction has different uses for gas taxes. In Ontario, gas taxes go to the general coffers for public health care and education. Its a different system than what Michigan has. So yes, we pay more for a trail permit, but to compare permit and fuel costs with another province or state, you need to compare all of the elements and not just a select few.
 

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Well put senior with the way cops should be operating. I agree ridership numbers are a huge problem that we need to address. One way to keep the costs down is to sign on to www.protectourvolunteers.com and make your voice heard. If this thing works we'll be in alot better situation. Fuel prices are my major concern this year. Hopefully everyone bites the bullet and continues to ride. 4 storkes are looking better all the time.
 

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If it wasnt so tough to cross the border , a lot more americans would be there . I have ridden Ontario a few times back around 98-99 , loved it, but to pay $180 for a pass that i may never get across the border to use, just dosnt make sence , neither does plannijng a trip , along with hotels and the rest of the shit just to get turned back at the border.
We are saddlebag riders and would love nothing more then to leave central NH and come on up, but so much easier to go to northern Maine. $65 , and 13,000 miles of trails.
 
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Originally posted by stevefromwestford@Oct 17 2005, 07:34 PM
If it wasnt so tough to cross the border , a lot more americans would be there . I have ridden Ontario a few times back around 98-99 , loved it, but to pay $180 for a pass that i may never get across the border to use, just dosnt make sence , neither does plannijng a trip , along with hotels and the rest of the shit just to get turned back at the border.
We are saddlebag riders and would love nothing more then to leave central NH and come on up, but so much easier to go to northern Maine. $65 , and 13,000 miles of trails.
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Let me guess you pled guilty but didn't do it. You must have issues if we won't let u in.
 
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