[Lickity Split]

So I was talking to a sales rep this weekend because I'm looking at a sled, so we started talking about the problems with the 04 Zrs and the DD problems with all the rest of them. He tells me that they fixed the problem, (he did mention that this fixes only 1/2 the problem with the 04's as they still have clutch issues), he was recently in touch with a cat rep recently and talkign about the top end lag problems and apperently this is the fix.... The cat rep told him to only use 3oz of oil in the DD case insted of the factory 4oz recommended and poof you've just fixed the top end problems on the 05 DD's.... He said that the biggest problems with the lag was that the DD case was building up too much pressure.

Is this really the whole solution to the problem???

 

[02TCATESRSS]

Originally posted by Lickity Split@Aug 29 2005, 09:54 AM
So I was talking to a sales rep this weekend because I'm looking at a sled, so we started talking about the problems with the 04 Zrs and the DD problems with all the rest of them.  He tells me that they fixed the problem, (he did mention that this fixes only 1/2 the problem with the 04's as they still have clutch issues), he was recently in touch with a cat rep recently and talkign about the top end lag problems and apperently this is the fix....  The cat rep told him to only use 3oz of oil in the DD case insted of the factory 4oz recommended and poof you've just fixed the top end problems on the 05 DD's.... He said that the biggest problems with the lag was that the DD case was building up too much pressure.

Is this really the whole solution to the problem???
<div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=851669

[/quote]
If Pressure is the problem, than an real quick/easy way to check it out would be to make a couple back to back runs , with high vrs low oil levels ,and see if the Radar #'s change. A simple vent :fart: just might be the DD's speed ticket.
[email protected]@D Luck!

 

[user2]

Originally posted by Lickity Split@Aug 29 2005, 09:54 AM
So I was talking to a sales rep this weekend because I'm looking at a sled, so we started talking about the problems with the 04 Zrs and the DD problems with all the rest of them.  He tells me that they fixed the problem, (he did mention that this fixes only 1/2 the problem with the 04's as they still have clutch issues), he was recently in touch with a cat rep recently and talkign about the top end lag problems and apperently this is the fix....  The cat rep told him to only use 3oz of oil in the DD case insted of the factory 4oz recommended and poof you've just fixed the top end problems on the 05 DD's.... He said that the biggest problems with the lag was that the DD case was building up too much pressure.

Is this really the whole solution to the problem???
<div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=851669

[/quote]
Theres a vent on my ZR900 DD and never has leaked any oil.
The problem is the small secondary reduces the belt surface area
which lets the belt start slipping when the secondary goes into
overdrive.

 

[Jester]

To many of us who wracked our brains this is old news. The problem was not pressure but cavitation in the drive itself. My buddy works in the manufacturing industry and came across this problem in 2004 and we frigged around with it until 3 0z was the best amount to keep the system lubed and not cavitating. We gained about 4 mph as a result. The rest is in the clutching. The 05 also have looser tolerances so they move alot freer on the trail. Alot less sound eminating from the drive as a result. They can be made fast, just not as fast as the 03 on a consistant basis. The low revving nature of the engine makes it harder to overcome the problems in the secondary. The 05 F7's rev higher and can be made to top end just like the 03/04. The fix seems to be in machining the secondary sheeves to help heat disipation and grip. Jury still out on that one but we will see.

Jester

 

[Lickity Split]

Originally posted by Jester@Aug 29 2005, 11:46 AM
To many of us who wracked our brains this is old news. The problem was not pressure but cavitation in the drive itself. My buddy works in the manufacturing industry and came across this problem in 2004 and we frigged around with it until 3 0z was the best amount to keep the system lubed and not cavitating. We gained about 4 mph as a result. The rest is in the clutching. The 05 also have looser tolerances so they move alot freer on the trail. Alot less sound eminating from the drive as a result. They can be made fast, just not as fast as the 03 on a consistant basis. The low revving nature of the engine makes it harder to overcome the problems in the secondary. The 05 F7's rev higher and can be made to top end just like the 03/04. The fix seems to be in machining the secondary sheeves to help heat disipation and grip. Jury still out on that one but we will see.

Jester
<div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=851848

[/quote]


I didn't mean to bore any of you, I'm just new to the whole cat thing, it was new to me and just thought I'd share it....

How much should some one machine off the secondary??

Thanks

 

[seymourf7]

'06s have bigger secondaries.....I wonder why that is? Guess we'll find out this winter. Seriously though, the secondaries need to be bigger for some technical reason, and I'm sure ODS Dan or some of the other mechanics on the site can give a more technical explanation.

Mike

 

[fatcat9]

As far as the clutches go, check out HiPerformance engineerings website. They have a kit for 169 plus you need the 80 dollar belt, to convert the 04s clutch to the 06 diameter. (10.4) Initially I had thought i would gear my new 900, but now I am thinking of doing the HPE kit (2 new sheaves, and you install your old clutches internals) and running 3 oz of fluid.. If I try it I will let you know..

 

[zr656]

Wow. The HiPerf kit seems like a deal. I was told around $300 for a new 10.4 secondary. I think I am gonna get one.

 

[user2]

Originally posted by Jester@Aug 29 2005, 12:46 PM
To many of us who wracked our brains this is old news. The problem was not pressure but cavitation in the drive itself. My buddy works in the manufacturing industry and came across this problem in 2004 and we frigged around with it until 3 0z was the best amount to keep the system lubed and not cavitating. We gained about 4 mph as a result. The rest is in the clutching. The 05 also have looser tolerances so they move alot freer on the trail. Alot less sound eminating from the drive as a result. They can be made fast, just not as fast as the 03 on a consistant basis. The low revving nature of the engine makes it harder to overcome the problems in the secondary. The 05 F7's rev higher and can be made to top end just like the 03/04. The fix seems to be in machining the secondary sheeves to help heat disipation and grip. Jury still out on that one but we will see.

Jester
<div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=851848

[/quote]
When the driveshaft was replaced the ring gear also was replaced. Only 3
oz of oil. I didnt radar it but on the trail I havent noticed any change. After
90mph its a pig. Doesnt jump like the T-CAT. The 900 is a great trail sled.

 

[C-notesnopro]

Originally posted by user2@Aug 30 2005, 09:41 AM
When the driveshaft was replaced the ring gear also was replaced.
<div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=853115

[/quote]
funny,,,,,,don't seem to remember any "ring gears" in update kits(did 4 last season) , only drive axle, oil, and new input shaft bearing,,,fwiw, where did you get YOUR kit from? oh4:

 

[JTD0314]

Any idea how much the more topend this 10.4 could result in ?

 

[C-notesnopro]

opcorn:

 

[JTD0314]

The 10.4 are available and I had the dealer order one for me today. He tells me this should make it pull better down low and more top end. This could be the big fix. :luxhello:

 

[user2]

Originally posted by C-NOTEPLUSf503@Aug 30 2005, 12:58 PM
funny,,,,,,don't seem to remember any "ring gears" in update kits(did 4 last season)  , only drive axle, oil, and new input shaft bearing,,,fwiw, where did you get YOUR  kit from? oh4:
<div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=853322

[/quote]
The driveshaft,ring gear,gearcase where replaced under warranty after
the driveshaft blew up in late FEB. The clutch kit and the new stronger driveshaft were replaced in OCT 04. The ring gear is the stock 0702-480.
Gearcase 0702-569. The update also had a new bearing and seal. I didnt
do the work as it was covered under warranty. I never rode the sled with
the first replacement driveshaft. The season ended before it was done.
This driveshaft [ NO 3] has 2000 miles on it. I was so pissed I snowchecked
a SKI-DOO. This still pisses me off. I will never buy the first year of any
snowmobile. 400 miles on a [fan] rental.......................................................
Bullet proof...........................................................................
......................

 

[C-notesnopro]

yeah, figured something like that, the update(stronger axle splines/oil seal/ brg/sealant)didn't have the ring gear, you hadn't mentioned the damage to yours, that's what had me wondering :div20:

 

[hough]

yea the first year of anything usually is a pain and i dont buy the first year... the DD came out in 04 so i thought i was safe... :doh:

but the clutching issues of the 05s is still a far cry from all the issues the 03s had for their first year... (firecats) :Wow1:

 

[user2]

When you buy a new sled and it has a few minor things or doesnt
seem to perform quite right I can deal with it. My 99 T-CAT ran poorly
at first but a few simple changes and I was in business. Blowing a drive
shaft at 1251 miles on a trail riden sled hurts. The sled was not run that
hard and failed on snow. Even more upsettings is CAT claimed the DD
wont be like the 03 F7s. It was bullet proof...THE DRIVESHAFT WAS MADE
OFF SHORE...........................................................................
............
I have die hard CAT owners who went to others after owning 03 F7s.
My dealer took care of me but I lost part of the 03-04 season. Half of
the driveshafts at my dealer failed. Mine had the fewest miles.
IF I DIDNT HAVE BAD LUCK I WOULDNT HAVE ANY

 

[DEVGRU]

Originally posted by Jester@Aug 29 2005, 11:46 AM
To many of us who wracked our brains this is old news. The problem was not pressure but cavitation in the drive itself. My buddy works in the manufacturing industry and came across this problem in 2004 and we frigged around with it until 3 0z was the best amount to keep the system lubed and not cavitating. We gained about 4 mph as a result. The rest is in the clutching. The 05 also have looser tolerances so they move alot freer on the trail. Alot less sound eminating from the drive as a result. They can be made fast, just not as fast as the 03 on a consistant basis. The low revving nature of the engine makes it harder to overcome the problems in the secondary. The 05 F7's rev higher and can be made to top end just like the 03/04. The fix seems to be in machining the secondary sheeves to help heat disipation and grip. Jury still out on that one but we will see.

Jester
<div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=851848

[/quote]

I am confused. What does cavitation have to do with this. Cavitaion can take several forms but the basics are, the formation of bubbles in a low pressure area of the pump volute. I would associate this with failures of gears rather than the ability of the gears to move. Was this a responce from CAT?

Thanks,
Dan

 

[JTD0314]

Originally posted by JTD0314@Aug 30 2005, 12:44 PM
Any idea how much the more topend this 10.4 could result in ?
<div align="right">index.php?act=findpost&pid=853383

[/quote]


Anybody?

 

[user2]

Outdoor shop claims 4 to 5 mph. Which seems possible.