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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Looking for suggestions on clutching for an XCR 800 at 6-10k elevation. The motor has been ported by Flannery and has hot seat 14:1 heads, VF3 reeds, and dynoport pipes (pipes have a stinger reducer recommended by Rich Daly) Track is a 159" x 2" and gearing is 19/39 if I remeber correctly. I used the following clutch set up in Togwotee WY for the past week. Sled performed well, but I think there is plenty left in the clutching.

Primary:
Almond/Blue 150/310
10-56

Secondary:
Team TSSo4
58/38
Red/black
2 delrin washers

this set up pulled 8200-8400, and would creep to 8500 on a long climb. Anyone have some suggestions for clutching? It seems that my SLP pipes pulled better than the current set up.
 

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I can't help you much, other than I would go to 19/43 gears, still good for almost 80 mph at 8500 rpm. Run three delrin washers, one on each end of the spring, one under the spring cup. 160/240 secondary spring. Is that a full progressive helix?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I can't help you much, other than I would go to 19/43 gears, still good for almost 80 mph at 8500 rpm. Run three delrin washers, one on each end of the spring, one under the spring cup. 160/240 secondary spring. Is that a full progressive helix?[/b]

Pockets, the helix is a .46 not a full progressive.

I double checked the clutch, I do have 3 Derlin washers in there already as described above. It doesn't feel like the clutch is opening fully when I am at altitude. I do not ride the sled at low elevation as race gas is spendy and a pain in the butt to get.

I tried really short gearing like you mentioned and the sled did not feel like it was loaded down, it felt like it was loafing although it was very revvy. It also trenched out in soft/deep snow very fast with 18/40 gearing.
 

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Pockets, the helix is a .46 not a full progressive.

I double checked the clutch, I do have 3 Derlin washers in there already as described above. It doesn't feel like the clutch is opening fully when I am at altitude. I do not ride the sled at low elevation as race gas is spendy and a pain in the butt to get.

I tried really short gearing like you mentioned and the sled did not feel like it was loaded down, it felt like it was loafing although it was very revvy. It also trenched out in soft/deep snow very fast with 18/40 gearing.[/b]

I am not up on the Team helixes Ean so I don't know if what you listed is a big helix for this application (I still like the button) but with my 700 and 18-41 gearing I pull a HSP 36S out west. I think with the taller gearing we need to add a lot more helix due to the increased mechanincal advantage. I do not see a reason to change the primary because we aren't making any more power, we are just changing the load/force on the secondary.

With the 45-36 the 700 would pull hard in the trees but lay down on the hills. It felt like I wasn't loading it enough.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I am not up on the Team helixes Ean so I don't know if what you listed is a big helix for this application (I still like the button) but with my 700 and 18-41 gearing I pull a HSP 36S out west. I think with the taller gearing we need to add a lot more helix due to the increased mechanincal advantage. I do not see a reason to change the primary because we aren't making any more power, we are just changing the load/force on the secondary.

With the 45-36 the 700 would pull hard in the trees but lay down on the hills. It felt like I wasn't loading it enough.[/b]

Chris, I am not sure I would consider the helix I have large, if anything, I think the helix is the issue. The sled pulls hard down low, but as you describe feels flat when climbing. I have 5 other helix's to try and I am going to start with a 66/44 .46 and see how the sled pulls it. I switched away from the button clutch due to the Team clutchs awesome backshift.
 

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The 44 will be too much I think. 42 finish angle for altitude. I know a 58/44-.46 with the 160/240 works well at lower elevation (2500' or so). With the short gearing it was probably not loaded enough with the helix.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Pockets, I have a 58/42 .46, think I should start with that and a black/purple? My next trip is to island park which is 6500-9000'. Have you used the 19/43 gearing with a long track? I have concerns of how the sled will pull it. When I went real low last year it didn't seem to work real well.
 

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Yes, I would start with the 58/42-.46 and black/purple. I have not used 19/43, but I know it is a preferred ratio for the mountains used by many. Usually in 800 twins, and being that you run more rpm, you have more speed. I would leave the gearing the way it is first, one change at a time.
 

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I have been running the team with a 58/44 and have not been able to get the Rs either I have 10/54s with a team green spring that is like 160/340. Saturday I stuck the stock button clutch back on it with the R12 helix and it made a world of difference. Now pulls 8800 and engages at about 4700. I wanted the backshift of the team but it's not worth it if you can't get the Rs.
I am running SLp pipes, porting and heads.

O yea I went to 20/41 gears with my 159x2.4
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
BB454, with the SLP pipes, SLP heads, and SLP Porting my sled pulled the 58/38 and 10-58's to 8800-9000 RPM in Island Park. Maybe you need less helix with the SLP pipes? The Dyno ports just seem to fall flat at this point with the clutching I have. Looks like I may bring a standard button Secondary with me to test against.
 

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BB454, with the SLP pipes, SLP heads, and SLP Porting my sled pulled the 58/38 and 10-58's to 8800-9000 RPM in Island Park. Maybe you need less helix with the SLP pipes? The Dyno ports just seem to fall flat at this point with the clutching I have. Looks like I may bring a standard button Secondary with me to test against.[/b]

Why the change to the Dyno Ports?

For us "geographically challenged" folks that have to drive 18+ hours is it worth all the bullshit? Any lack of HP in pipes can be made up in "other areas" LOL

I guess that is up to you:)

When are you gonna be in IP? I have a trip to Jellystone the 3rd week of Feb. 1 more year on the old 7 and then I will be renting.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I changed to the Dyno Ports for added torque. Dicking it with it at least gives me something to do during the work week, I think I have the issue narrowed down to a few easy things to check/change. And the 15+hp over the SLP package was worth it to me.

Going to Island Park Febuary 2-10th.
 

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I changed to the Dyno Ports for added torque. Dicking it with it at least gives me something to do during the work week, I think I have the issue narrowed down to a few easy things to check/change. And the 15+hp over the SLP package was worth it to me.

Going to Island Park Febuary 2-10th.[/b]

Them be good ponies:) WELL worth the effort!
 

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the team clutch caused the trenching not the gearing. the lower gearing will make it easer to start out without trenching. personally for mountain riding i would run a button clutch with a silver blue secondary spring and straight 36 helix. and then run whatever primary weights you can pull at elevation. i would be money this setup will be better than the team setup?
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Went out testing on Saturday. After testing it seems that a 42 finish works well while the higher intial rate springs (black/purple 160-240) only added to the belt heat and kept the sled from shifting out fully. Tried a 56/42 .36 with a red/blue and a black/green primary and 10-64's. It pulled 8400-8500, this generated the best acceleration of all the items I tried. I also have a 64/42 to try that I think will out perform the 56/42.

The stinger reducers are still in place and these tests were performed on 110 fuel. I am sure the sled will accelerate harder once I remove the reducers.

I have the button secondary here and set up with a straight 36 and cat yellow as per Doug F and will throw it on next weekend.

Notable change was the switch to a stock CDI, my CDI had been flashed to work with the SLP pipes I had. The stock CDI also seemed to add some midrange pull to the sled. Doug felt that the SLP pipes required more timing than the Dyno ports which was hurting pipe heat and not allowing the pipes to get to the proper temp. Doug also told me to retime the motor to 28* of base timing which will be done this week.
 
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