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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I was reading the other post and I must say that I just shook my head,

we have people going back and forth about which state produced the most deaths when in reality it doesnt matter, the bottom line is that 30 some people went snowmobiling to have a good time and they never came home. It doesnt matter where they came from or what the circumstances are, the fact is that 36 people lost thier lives. So instead of throwing your chests out at each other, think of the little girl whose daddy will never kiss her goodnight again or think of the little girl that just drowned on Tomahawk lake, one minute she is having fun with her daddy and the next minute she is losing the fight for her life. The way people have been reducing human life to mere statistics makes me sick, more than 30 people are dead, and it doesnt get any more final then that.

Our sport is fragile enough on its own, we are losing miles of trail every year and it doesnt matter who is doing it, the fact is that it is happening. So you can either sit there and bitch at each other or we can come together for the good of the sport and get rid of the people that are ruining it for everybody NO MATTER WHERE THEY CAME FROM. Or we can just do nothing and watch the trail system and the sport crumble. We truly control our destiny.

DS
 

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:div20: excellent rant.
 

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I likey. Good post :no_bashing: . I just can't believe all the bitching that is going on in general. I'm afraid to post anything for fear of starting World War 3. Lets all just pray for snow instead.
 

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I was reading the other post and I must say that I just shook my head,

we have people going back and forth about which state produced the most deaths when in reality it doesnt matter, the bottom line is that 30 some people went snowmobiling to have a good time and they never came home. It doesnt matter where they came from or what the circumstances are, the fact is that 36 people lost thier lives. So instead of throwing your chests out at each other, think of the little girl whose daddy will never kiss her goodnight again or think of the little girl that just drowned on Tomahawk lake, one minute she is having fun with her daddy and the next minute she is losing the fight for her life. The way people have been reducing human life to mere statistics makes me sick, more than 30 people are dead, and it doesnt get any more final then that.

Our sport is fragile enough on its own, we are losing miles of trail every year and it doesnt matter who is doing it, the fact is that it is happening. So you can either sit there and bitch at each other or we can come together for the good of the sport and get rid of the people that are ruining it for everybody NO MATTER WHERE THEY CAME FROM. Or we can just do nothing and watch the trail system and the sport crumble. We truly control our destiny.

DS[/b]

Very well said ! :div20:
 

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I just can't believe all the bitching that is going on in general. I'm afraid to post anything for fear of starting World War 3. Lets all just pray for snow instead.[/b]
Dont be shy, Ive started and taken part in many of those type threads and while people will argue and act all big and bad, they all have a short memory.
I agree that its sad to reduce someone who died to a statistic, but the fact is that in many of these accidents the people brought it upon themselves.
You mentioned the little girl who drowned. Now, I dont want to seem cold. Its terrible that she died like that, but what kinda idiot drives a Ski-Doo Elite out on the lake when its been 35 degrees all winter??? Its like Ron White says, "you cant fix stupid."
The fact is that snowmobiling is a dangerous sport and we have to accept that. No matter how safe you try to be, things can happen out on the trail and theres not much you can do about it. :dunno:
 

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I agree that alot of these deaths are caused but idiots doing stupid things, sad but true. People die doing diffrent things every day. Its sad but deaths are most often a fact as well as a fact of life. No one here is trying to belittle the fact thats is senceless but don't try to make us fell like shit for not taking each death to heart. My best friend was killed at 20, 4 years ago while drilling a well he touched a powerline with the drill rig and was electricuted. No one except for friends and family gave a fuck. So, I ask you what commitment do I have to the 30 odd people killed having fun last year. Our comments are harmless, so we need to take them for what there worth and not get all bent out of shape about nothing.
 

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I agree that alot of these deaths are caused but idiots doing stupid things, sad but true. People die doing diffrent things every day. Its sad but deaths are most often a fact as well as a fact of life. No one here is trying to belittle the fact thats is senceless but don't try to make us fell like shit for not taking each death to heart. My best friend was killed at 20, 4 years ago while drilling a well he touched a powerline with the drill rig and was electricuted. No one except for friends and family gave a fuck. So, I ask you what commitment do I have to the 30 odd people killed having fun last year. Our comments are harmless, so we need to take them for what there worth and not get all bent out of shape about nothing.[/b]
Well said
 

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I agree that alot of these deaths are caused but idiots doing stupid things, sad but true. People die doing diffrent things every day. Its sad but deaths are most often a fact as well as a fact of life. No one here is trying to belittle the fact thats is senceless but don't try to make us fell like shit for not taking each death to heart. My best friend was killed at 20, 4 years ago while drilling a well he touched a powerline with the drill rig and was electricuted. No one except for friends and family gave a fuck. So, I ask you what commitment do I have to the 30 odd people killed having fun last year. Our comments are harmless, so we need to take them for what there worth and not get all bent out of shape about nothing.[/b]
I agree. We can sit here and preach all we want, but you will always have people who make foolish choices and in some cases pay the ultimate price for those choices. :dunno:
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I agree that alot of these deaths are caused but idiots doing stupid things, sad but true. People die doing diffrent things every day. Its sad but deaths are most often a fact as well as a fact of life. No one here is trying to belittle the fact thats is senceless but don't try to make us fell like shit for not taking each death to heart. My best friend was killed at 20, 4 years ago while drilling a well he touched a powerline with the drill rig and was electricuted. No one except for friends and family gave a fuck. So, I ask you what commitment do I have to the 30 odd people killed having fun last year. Our comments are harmless, so we need to take them for what there worth and not get all bent out of shape about nothing.[/b]
First off, I wasnt trying to make anyone feel like shit and I apologize if I did, I just get really bummed out when children get killed. The commitment you have to those who have been killed in my opinion is to help prevent future fatalities, so when people do come to have fun, they make it home. Drunk people flying down the trails and idiots doing stupid things dont always kill themselves, sometimes they run into and kill other snowmobilers while they walk with minor injuries. The next person to get killed in what could have been a preventable accident could be you, is your life the "nothing" i shouldnt get all bent out of shape about?.

DS
 

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First off, I wasnt trying to make anyone feel like shit and I apologize if I did, I just get really bummed out when children get killed. The commitment you have to those who have been killed in my opinion is to help prevent future fatalities, so when people do come to have fun, they make it home. Drunk people flying down the trails and idiots doing stupid things dont always kill themselves, sometimes they run into and kill other snowmobilers while they walk with minor injuries. The next person to get killed in what could have been a preventable accident could be you, is your life the "nothing" i shouldnt get all bent out of shape about?.

DS[/b]
Our lifes arent "nothing", but we all know the risks. We know that every time we throw a leg over the sled and go riding that we might not come home that night. Thats just reality.
Anyone who thinks that snowmobiling is 100% safe is only fooling themselves.
 

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I would 100% think you should not give two shits if I am the one killed. All im saying is thousands of people are killed tragicly every year. Do you care my best friend died, NO, so why would you care if I die. Where do you draw the line with who you care dies. for some people let it be a stat, its life, sad but true. I happen to be a fireman/paramedic, I see at least 5-6 people killed in car wrecks, another 15-20 cardiac arrests, and 5-6 stab/shot to death every year. Do you know how terrible my life would be if I got attached to the patients? Sorry if im course but dont cry for me I wouldent want to be the one who put that burden on perfect strangers.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I would 100% think you should not give two shits if I am the one killed. All im saying is thousands of people are killed tragicly every year. Do you care my best friend died, NO, so why would you care if I die. Where do you draw the line with who you care dies. for some people let it be a stat, its life, sad but true. I happen to be a fireman/paramedic, I see at least 5-6 people killed in car wrecks, another 15-20 cardiac arrests, and 5-6 stab/shot to death every year. Do you know how terrible my life would be if I got attached to the patients? Sorry if im course but dont cry for me I wouldent want to be the one who put that burden on perfect strangers.[/b]
Yeah, in your line of work you need to be de sensitized otherwise you will go nuts, I certainly couldnt do what you do. Yeah, I think your friend getting killed just as he is getting into the prime of his life sucks, freak accident or not. The long and short of it is if the speed and alchohol related deaths dont decrease and if people keep going off trail and trespassing on private land and not acting responsibly, more and more landowners are going to shut off thier land and the trail system will suffer for it and the trickle down effect will hurt everyone. I know the people that act stupidly are a small percentage of riders, but unfortunately they get the most press and they are killing the sport. Those are the people we need to get to and try to chill them out a bit.

DS
 

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The old saying that " you can't fix stupid" is a common thread when linked to the deaths in some circumstances. It was very unfortunate that last week a young girl passed away. In hindsight we look back and say that this was preventable. Yes, it was preventable, if you stop an outdoor activity that you really enjoy and live in a fishbowl the rest of your life and never venture out of your home again. Then of course,WHAM, carbon monoxide poisoning from a faulty heat exchanger in the furnace.

What I am saying is that a successful Doctor was enjoying a ride with his daughter, and a very sad, tragic event happend. As a parent I can with 100% certainty say that that man had absolutely no intention of ANYTHING happening to his daughter that day, or any other day for that matter. It was an accident.

Now that brings me to the part that should be fixable, the intentional bout of brain fade when someone does something stupid, and knows that it is really stupid, and still does it. Flying through the twisties, water skipping, jumping blind hills, and I am sure we can all add a few that we have seen, or done in the past. I will even include the two biggest, Speed and Alcohol. Ususally those two things are seperate but when you have fast sleds, people, a weekend off, and freinds to egg you on, the smart button gets left with your change of underwear back at the cabin. It is unfortunate that in some cases an innocent bystander will be in the wrong place at the wrong time, an unwilling participant in your stupidity. That would qualify as "buzz kill" if something would happen to that person, hurt, killed, because you did something dumb. Earlier someone said that you may pay the ultimate price anytime you throw your leg over the saddle. I have read some really stupid comments, that has to rank right up there with the topper. What do you think we are doing here going to battle? It is that very mind set that is the root cause of most accidents(stupidity) that occure. If you go out with the mindset that there is a realistic chance of you not making it back from your ride, DO NOT GO ! The last thing I want to meet on the trail is someone who is intent on going faster, beating their buddy, or drinking more than the guy who just poured themselves into a cab. WOW, just think, that guy in the cab was the smart one.

Especially this time of year when the riding area is very condensed, we should all use significantly more common sense because the races are for racing, not the trails. One poster in another thread took his wife up north last week and had a great time, he probably slowed it up just a little and enjoyed it immensely. Have fun, thay is what this activity is all about. Please THINK, and try to use some common sense before you strap on the stupid cap and gas it.

There should be absolutely no reason for 37 people to die on a snowmobile. Twice what the number was in Minnesota. A vast majority of these deaths would have been avoidable, with just a twinge of common sense. If the numbers go higher you can look for significantly more land owners that will close their property, more legislation to slow down snowmobilers More, more, more, of everthing that would take more of the fun out of snowmobiling. Further limits on our sport, it does not have to happen. We will never have a zero death year I am certain. We should easily be able to dratically reduce the numbers from a year ago. Especially, if the first person to change the trend is you.


Alright I am off the soap box for now because I have a trip planned and have to get ready
 

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What I am saying is that a successful Doctor was enjoying a ride with his daughter, and a very sad, tragic event happend. As a parent I can with 100% certainty say that that man had absolutely no intention of ANYTHING happening to his daughter that day, or any other day for that matter. It was an accident.[/b]
True, but youd think he would know better than to try to ride an Elite on a lake considering how warm it has been. It wont ride my own sled on the lake right now, let alone something heavy like an Elite. Thats was just plain stupid and he should have known better.
I feel bad for the little girl who died because she was an innocent child, but I dont feel bad for the driver. They should have known better and sadly, it was that innocent little girl who paid the ultimate price for it.
I willingly accept that fact that snowmobiling could kill me. The way I see it, you can play it safe, live to be 100 and die anyways, or you can live you life as you see fit, drink, smoke, screw some hot chicks, have some fun, do what you want and die happy.
 

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I willingly accept that fact that snowmobiling could kill me. The way I see it, you can play it safe, live to be 100 and die anyways, or you can live you life as you see fit, drink, smoke, screw some hot chicks, have some fun, do what you want and die happy.[/b]
Not that I would agree with being careless or stupid, but I sure do agree with your attitude on life!
 

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Not that I would agree with being careless or stupid, but I sure do agree with your attitude on life![/b]
Thank you. :beerchug: Id like to think that I have a pretty good attitude about life. When Im dead and gone I want people to think about me with a smile on their face and say, "Yeah, he was one crazy son of a bitch". :div20:
Not living scares me a whole heck of a lot than dying.
 

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True, but youd think he would know better than to try to ride an Elite on a lake considering how warm it has been. It wont ride my own sled on the lake right now, let alone something heavy like an Elite. Thats was just plain stupid and he should have known better.
I feel bad for the little girl who died because she was an innocent child, but I dont feel bad for the driver. They should have known better and sadly, it was that innocent little girl who paid the ultimate price for it.
I willingly accept that fact that snowmobiling could kill me. The way I see it, you can play it safe, live to be 100 and die anyways, or you can live you life as you see fit, drink, smoke, screw some hot chicks, have some fun, do what you want and die happy.[/b]
We all make choices that we will regret for the rest of our lives . The man that lost his daughter will carry a burden that very few will ever know. I happend to talk to someone that was on Lake Tom that same day fishing and he knows where it happend, somewhere near windy point. I am not familiar with that lake so I cannot pinpoint it any further than that. From what I was told there were two other sleds that went in near the same spot earlier that day, and he thought that the Elite went in at the exact same spot as the other two. We can debate the rational of this incident for days and never get anywhere. I am sure that with the lake marked most would assume that it is safe. I also heard reports of the lakes being marked with onl 5 inches of ice. A big lake like Lake Tomahawk is so big that if you have 5 inches in one spot, you may also have open water in others. You are correct that the driver should have been more wary of the condidtions. But, everyone was trying to get on the sleds as soon as possible and many were probably pushing the season too soon also.

We probably share to an extent a very high zest for life too. Although the differences are very glaring. I can say I have never gotten on a snowmobile, motorcycle, driven a car, or got in a boat or anything else with the mindset that I could die, period. Everyday life is dangerous and something could happen to you as you walk down the street, but to think when you get up that this could be my last day is also not rational thought either. You can have a great time in this life and go along way, push the envelope pretty far, and probably have some narrow escapes along the way, that's life. When you have family, and kids, it also changes your thinking greatly too. When you have other responsibilities, your priorities, and your life goals will change too. This also is another point that we can debate forever, and for what, untill you have some of those experiences you will not know.

The main point I tried to make was that you can go up and ride, have a great time, and really enjoy a ton of great times snowmobiling. If we all do not all take responsibity and preserve the opportunities that we have today to ride for thousands of miles on groomed trails with few if any restrictions, we will lose that opportunity. If you think for one minute that 37 people killed last season was not a huge factor in the night speed limit, you are kidding yourself. If you think that responsible riders who have pipes on their machines with an ounce of thought are the ones who caused the laws linked to the noise, or the few who do not care and irresponsibly brap their pipes drawing attention to themselves while warming up their machines, or at the bar in a residential area. If you think that there is not a day time speed limit on the table as we speak in the Wisconsin legislature, you are also kidding yourself. We can continue to ride off trail on private property too, at least untill the landowner decides to close off their property because they are fed up with people abusing the priveledge to ride on their property. Most of the landowners do not even ride, but allow access to their property. There are 250k snowmobiles in Wisconsin, and 7 million residents, what majority do you think the lawmakers will always side with, think about it? You cannot even say anything about the tourism money it brings in, just look at what is happenning out west. They have all but closed off Yellowstone for snowmobiles, because of problems and abuse of the trail system and the damages to the local environment. If you think that same thing is not happenning here too, you need to do more research. Just a quick scam of some of the club sites, their newsletters are filled with stories about landowner refusing to continue land use agreements, and the need for volunteers to re-route trails and cut new ones.

So as snowmobilers we can either find ways to preserve our sport, or we can continue to let it deteriorate to the point that we have nowhere to go anymore because we have abused it to the point that the trail system as we now know it is gone. If we all consider the alternative to our behavior is further limitations, laws, enforcement, and restricted trail access, you be the one who looks in the mirroe aans says are my actions part of the problem.. Be a part of the solution rather than the problem. Have a ton of fun, but like anything else taking responsibility for your actions. If we all do not all share the responsibility and work together our sport could also be one of those tragedies that we look back at and say, that was really stupid, and very preventable.

I hope you get your sled together for the weekend, we have to hold off until next weekend before we get our first rides of the year in.

Later,
 

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From what I was told....The lake was not marked and the dnr was placing ornage barrels on the boat landings to keep people off them and they were being moved by some individuals so they could go on the lake. Not 100% as I was told this. Not that it changes anything...
 
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