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Discussion Starter #1
just found this out today. the rollers in the driven clutch are now way bigger? and the helix is die cast instead of the sand cast used for years? talk with venom this morning. they just found out as well. there will not be a 2 ramp helix for these. not enough room. we have over 100 clutch kits for these already sold. great going to cost us to make this right. the easiest way is by just replacing the rollers. then the older helix will work. this from venom. so no more twin trax helix. that kind of suck's. no word of wye the change? venom has no idea why they did this yet.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
nope i have never changed a roller in a team clutch. i have some customers with way over 10,000 miles on them. gone through 2-3 drive clutches or full rebuilds in that mileage. only thing i have changed or replaced in a tss-04 is the big metal washer the belt deflection bolt pushes on and a couple movable sheave bushing's that's it.
 

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Larger diameter roller may reduce the reverse to forward clunk. Seems that helix will have to b different too or it would further limit top end? I switched to a tied on my 18 assault and noticed better, more consistent back shift, cooler belt temps and sled cruises at 60mph at a lower rpm. Can’t remember what helix angel I settled on but it is at least 15degrees steeper than stock.
 

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nope i have never changed a roller in a team clutch. i have some customers with way over 10,000 miles on them. gone through 2-3 drive clutches or full rebuilds in that mileage. only thing i have changed or replaced in a tss-04 is the big metal washer the belt deflection bolt pushes on and a couple movable sheave bushing's that's it.
I replaced two in separate clutches. I am sure both were from operators backing sleds up and then hammering throttle. I believe the roller was right at edge of reverse notch and belt ranked clutch open and split the rollers.
 

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Thats weird. Theres got to be a reason for that. But on a secondary that has no real issues? Do you think the rollers are going to have bearings in them? Make back shifting easier?
 

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$? Fine for Polaris, but for the guy who wants to experiment might have to buy more helix’s. I’m sure they won’t be 1/2 the price. Plus, they don’t like Rick!’s criticism! 😂
 

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Couldn't a guy take his never ran, already set-up (balanced, sprung, custom helix, etc.) TSS-04 from MY19 (or whatever) and swap it for the TSS-04 that comes on the VR1/Assault Matryx for MY21?
 

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just found this out today. the rollers in the driven clutch are now way bigger? and the helix is die cast instead of the sand cast used for years? talk with venom this morning. they just found out as well. there will not be a 2 ramp helix for these. not enough room. we have over 100 clutch kits for these already sold. great going to cost us to make this right. the easiest way is by just replacing the rollers. then the older helix will work. this from venom. so no more twin trax helix. that kind of suck's. no word of wye the change? venom has no idea why they did this yet.
Well that would explain why Polaris has a new part number for a helix with the same spec.

Matryx helix is: 5143872 RAMP-58/44/.36 BA35 ER,LWT
. used in
. All Matryx
+ These AXYS sleds:
. MY21 850 INDY
. MY21 850 Switchback 137 (ProXC susp.)
. MY21 850 Switchback Assault 144, uses 5434534 $38US roller ?? parts diagram mistake??

Matryx secondary roller is: 3514929 ROLLER-BTD, 9.58mm ID x28.83 OD x13.97W, CE $15US
. used in MY18-21 800 Titans with the BOSS secondary clutch (NOT Team TSS-04)
. ALL Matryx
+ These AXYS sleds:
. MY21 600,850 AXYS INDY, 600 uses 5143879 helix-48/42/.36 BA35 ER,LWT
. MY21 600,850 SB 137 (ProXC susp.) 600 uses 5143879 helix-48/42/.36 BA35 ER,LWT
, MY21 600 Switchback Assault 144 uses 5143879 helix-48/42/.36 BA35 ER,LWT
. MY21 850 SKS 146 uses helix 5143882 RAMP-60/44/.36 BAE ER LWT

NOTE: the newer larger MATRYX roller 3514929 and the older smaller 5434534 roller, are secured to the pins on the internally splined carrier ring, by the same
7556226 Washer, Thrust
7710523 E-Ring Retaining, so the rollers should interchange on a TSS-04 secondary clutch, unless there is a difference in the LENGTH of the pins on the carrier ring.
 

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Couldn't a guy take his never ran, already set-up (balanced, sprung, custom helix, etc.) TSS-04 from MY19 (or whatever) and swap it for the TSS-04 that comes on the VR1/Assault Matryx for MY21?
Yeah of course. There are plenty of used ones on eBay, etc. for cheap also.
 

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So did it start with the Titan model in 18?
Use of this larger roller started with the MY18 Titan, but that was in conjunction with the BOSS secondary, NOT the Team TSS-04.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
this was second hand info as i do not have a new driven clutch yet. venom told me it was a tss-04? i'am now wondering if these have the boss secondary? i will find out tomorrow.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
$? Fine for Polaris, but for the guy who wants to experiment might have to buy more helix’s. I’m sure they won’t be 1/2 the price. Plus, they don’t like Rick!’s criticism! 😂
maybe not but i'am getting them to change shit' NSK bearings now. t-stat outside the motor. etc. wonder where they got these from? they even followed our gearing on the 600's.
 

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this was second hand info as i do not have a new driven clutch yet. venom told me it was a tss-04? i'am now wondering if these have the boss secondary? i will find out tomorrow.
Could Venom have been looking at a Titan? I don't think so...

The other MY21 sleds definitely have TSS-04 according to the parts books. There is no independent helix in the Boss secondary, the helix track is built into the movable sheave.

2108067


Boss Secondary on MY21 Polaris Titan
 

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Discussion Starter #18
that's not the clutch the guy text me. it definitely has a separate helix. so it must be a tss-4. venom said to just change the rollers to the original smaller ones. and the old helix will work just fine. wonder why the change? my thought is maybe it up shift's and back shifts better? I'm sure Polaris see's all this talk about the roller bearing set-up? maybe this is there answer without adding cost? if the only thing changed is the size of the roller and the machining of the slot in the helix? it probably wasn't a tooling change but just a new CNC program. weird about going from a sand cast ( cheaper) to a die cast helix? maybe the material used in sand cast has gone up? making it cheaper to die cast them now?
 

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These bigger rollers were brought up on Facebook a few days ago. More incentive for me to try my P2 secondarys
 
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