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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Well it happened, my new toy finally let go. I was cruising along at 85mph/8000rpm when the sled just died. Pulled the plugs to find the PTO side coated in aluminum and the mag side not far behind, but still brown in color just had specks on it. I ripped it apart to find the PTO side piston melted bad and the mag side had a dimple in the centre about the size of my baby finger nail. It looks like it went lean but I can figure out why. It had 470 mains in it, with a Vari-a-flow, gutted air box, boost bottle, and a slp intake. I've read on here that guys run these 700's down to 420 mains without issue, but I put 470's in mine and it burns down.
 

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Probably some other fuel issue. I ran 470's from new and could hold it WOT for miles. Not sure about vari-flow, I have the Tempa Flow. Sucks to burn down.
 

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What grade fuel were you running in it?If it was Regular or mid-grade,they now have ethanol in it,and if you don't jet up 2 sizes you may have this result.Ethanol leans out your fuel mixture.Just a possibility.Use premium regardless.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I'm thinking it was water myself. I was out at the lake and was running low on fuel so I used some regular I had out there and I think it had water in it from sitting.
 

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Ranger 5.0
I've ran a Variflow on my '03 700 for over three years now. Aside from other mods, I run a SLP pipe and 420 mains. I also run EGTs and have spent plenty of time observing piston wash. I am comfortable with the 420's down to about 0F. I use the Variflow to dial her in when temps are in the 15-40 degree range. I can tell you from the egt observations that the product works as advertised.

Here are my questions to you? Did you install the variflow yourself or was it on the sled when you bought it? The reason I ask is because an incorrect setup can get expensive quickly. I run mine with no inlet jet (large tubing) and the aluminum and brass outlet jets combined (small tubing) This results in the tightest range of control (About 7% reduction in position 4) and is plenty for a 30-40 degree temp swing at the same elevation. I've seen a few sleds with no jets installed in the outlet tubing. This results in an aggressive reduction in fuel flow (5%, 10%, 15% & 20%) in positions 1 thru 4 respectively.

Also keep in mind that the variflow reduces fuel flow across the entire fuel spectrum, not just WOT. So the first thing I would do is verify the Variflow installation.

Secondly, your cruising along at 85mph comment also caught my interest. Take a cold night with hardpack or ice conditions and little rolling resistance. The sled is running very efficiently. You back off on the throttle a bit, but your still clipping along at 85. As the needles drop further into the mains, the temps goes up and the aluminum starts to puddle. A second or two later you're done. Seen it happen too many times over the years. I can get the egts on my 700 to climb near the danger zone on many days by holding the throttle in just the right position in the midrange and because the needle drops so far in the mains, the size of the main becomes somewhat irrelevant.

Here is my last thought. A lot of guys like to drop the needles a clip to clean up the mid-range that is often rich from the factory. Switching gears for a second, Let me ask you another question about your riding style. Do you vary your throttle position frequently or do you like to hold it in a fixed position? Were you at WOT when it died? The reason I ask is that I feel people who like to ride without varying throttle position frequently need to be extremely cautious about dropping needles and leaning out the midrange. The reason is that it increases the likleyhood of creating the blowtorch I described in the previous paragraph. Over the years I have seen too many burn downs similar to what you described with either lowered needles, fixed throttle position or a combination of both.

If I was attempting to diagnose this, I would be verifying the following in order:

Variflow installation
Correct needles and what position
Riding conditions of the burndown, (temp, snow conditions, humidity etc)
Your riding style (fixed throttle of varied)
Age of fuel
Possibility of water in the fuel (Do you run isopropyl?)
Condition of the fuel pump
Condition of crank seals

Usually with water in the fuel, you'll only freeze up one main and trash only that cylinder.

Good luck
 

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Ranger 5.0
I've ran a Variflow on my '03 700 for over three years now. Aside from other mods, I run a SLP pipe and 420 mains. I also run EGTs and have spent plenty of time observing piston wash. I am comfortable with the 420's down to about 0F. I use the Variflow to dial her in when temps are in the 15-40 degree range. I can tell you from the egt observations that the product works as advertised.

Here are my questions to you? Did you install the variflow yourself or was it on the sled when you bought it? The reason I ask is because an incorrect setup can get expensive quickly. I run mine with no inlet jet (large tubing) and the aluminum and brass outlet jets combined (small tubing) This results in the tightest range of control (About 7% reduction in position 4) and is plenty for a 30-40 degree temp swing at the same elevation. I've seen a few sleds with no jets installed in the outlet tubing. This results in an aggressive reduction in fuel flow (5%, 10%, 15% & 20%) in positions 1 thru 4 respectively.

Also keep in mind that the variflow reduces fuel flow across the entire fuel spectrum, not just WOT. So the first thing I would do is verify the Variflow installation.

Secondly, your cruising along at 85mph comment also caught my interest. Take a cold night with hardpack or ice conditions and little rolling resistance. The sled is running very efficiently. You back off on the throttle a bit, but your still clipping along at 85. As the needles drop further into the mains, the temps goes up and the aluminum starts to puddle. A second or two later you're done. Seen it happen too many times over the years. I can get the egts on my 700 to climb near the danger zone on many days by holding the throttle in just the right position in the midrange and because the needle drops so far in the mains, the size of the main becomes somewhat irrelevant.

Here is my last thought. A lot of guys like to drop the needles a clip to clean up the mid-range that is often rich from the factory. Switching gears for a second, Let me ask you another question about your riding style. Do you vary your throttle position frequently or do you like to hold it in a fixed position? Were you at WOT when it died? The reason I ask is that I feel people who like to ride without varying throttle position frequently need to be extremely cautious about dropping needles and leaning out the midrange. The reason is that it increases the likleyhood of creating the blowtorch I described in the previous paragraph. Over the years I have seen too many burn downs similar to what you described with either lowered needles, fixed throttle position or a combination of both.

If I was attempting to diagnose this, I would be verifying the following in order:

Variflow installation
Correct needles and what position
Riding conditions of the burndown, (temp, snow conditions, humidity etc)
Your riding style (fixed throttle of varied)
Age of fuel
Possibility of water in the fuel (Do you run isopropyl?)
Condition of the fuel pump
Condition of crank seals

Usually with water in the fuel, you'll only freeze up one main and trash only that cylinder.

Good luck[/b]


Yes, excellent post! I would like to add that there is no need to run bigger mains than stock, kinda defeats the purpose of jetting down. You want to lean the big jets down so you might be close to stock?
I also install some needle shims to richen the mids so it is safer when you have the variflow clicked down for the mains
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Ranger 5.0
I've ran a Variflow on my '03 700 for over three years now. Aside from other mods, I run a SLP pipe and 420 mains. I also run EGTs and have spent plenty of time observing piston wash. I am comfortable with the 420's down to about 0F. I use the Variflow to dial her in when temps are in the 15-40 degree range. I can tell you from the egt observations that the product works as advertised.

Here are my questions to you? Did you install the variflow yourself or was it on the sled when you bought it? The reason I ask is because an incorrect setup can get expensive quickly. I run mine with no inlet jet (large tubing) and the aluminum and brass outlet jets combined (small tubing) This results in the tightest range of control (About 7% reduction in position 4) and is plenty for a 30-40 degree temp swing at the same elevation. I've seen a few sleds with no jets installed in the outlet tubing. This results in an aggressive reduction in fuel flow (5%, 10%, 15% & 20%) in positions 1 thru 4 respectively.

Also keep in mind that the variflow reduces fuel flow across the entire fuel spectrum, not just WOT. So the first thing I would do is verify the Variflow installation.

Secondly, your cruising along at 85mph comment also caught my interest. Take a cold night with hardpack or ice conditions and little rolling resistance. The sled is running very efficiently. You back off on the throttle a bit, but your still clipping along at 85. As the needles drop further into the mains, the temps goes up and the aluminum starts to puddle. A second or two later you're done. Seen it happen too many times over the years. I can get the egts on my 700 to climb near the danger zone on many days by holding the throttle in just the right position in the midrange and because the needle drops so far in the mains, the size of the main becomes somewhat irrelevant.

Here is my last thought. A lot of guys like to drop the needles a clip to clean up the mid-range that is often rich from the factory. Switching gears for a second, Let me ask you another question about your riding style. Do you vary your throttle position frequently or do you like to hold it in a fixed position? Were you at WOT when it died? The reason I ask is that I feel people who like to ride without varying throttle position frequently need to be extremely cautious about dropping needles and leaning out the midrange. The reason is that it increases the likleyhood of creating the blowtorch I described in the previous paragraph. Over the years I have seen too many burn downs similar to what you described with either lowered needles, fixed throttle position or a combination of both.

If I was attempting to diagnose this, I would be verifying the following in order:

Variflow installation
Correct needles and what position
Riding conditions of the burndown, (temp, snow conditions, humidity etc)
Your riding style (fixed throttle of varied)
Age of fuel
Possibility of water in the fuel (Do you run isopropyl?)
Condition of the fuel pump
Condition of crank seals

Usually with water in the fuel, you'll only freeze up one main and trash only that cylinder.

Good luck[/b]
Well the vari-a-flow was installed by the previous owner so I can't verify it's install because I have no instructions for it. all I know is there is a 2" piece or large tubing installed in the air box on the end of the adjuster which is mounted to the air box. the needles are in the stock position, and I like to vary the throttle when I ride but I was at wide open when it happened although it was a relatively warm day, ie -2 Celsius. I'm thinking it was the age of the fuel along with water. I don't think it was the fuel pump or seals because the sled only has 4800 miles on it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Well the vari-a-flow was installed by the previous owner so I can't verify it's install because I have no instructions for it. all I know is there is a 2" piece or large tubing installed in the air box on the end of the adjuster which is mounted to the air box. the needles are in the stock position, and I like to vary the throttle when I ride but I was at wide open when it happened although it was a relatively warm day, ie -2 Celsius. I'm thinking it was the age of the fuel along with water. I don't think it was the fuel pump or seals because the sled only has 4800 miles on it.[/b]

Oh and I was using Polaris gold VES oil. But I was thinking of switching to Ipone.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
On a side note, after I rebuild the engine I have a SLP single pipe I'm going to put on it. What would be good clutching and jetting for this pipe/y-pipe combo? I think it has an SLP clutch kit in it, it has an orange secondary spring, with a 50/36 helix. and it had a red primary spring but I put a white Heel Clicker spring in it. I'm leary about using the 470 jets I have in it now, maybe switching to 500's.
 

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Are you sure its not a tempa-flow you have????Is the adjuster a white knob in a black tube with a dot that you need a screwdriver to adjust and its half in the airbox with a tube running to a tee in the airbox????Vari-flows have a knob typically mounted on the dash,or key area.
 

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On a side note, after I rebuild the engine I have a SLP single pipe I'm going to put on it. What would be good clutching and jetting for this pipe/y-pipe combo? I think it has an SLP clutch kit in it, it has an orange secondary spring, with a 50/36 helix. and it had a red primary spring but I put a white Heel Clicker spring in it. I'm leary about using the 470 jets I have in it now, maybe switching to 500's.[/b]
64 or 66 grams. I run a team blue primary which I believe is between a Erlanson Red and Yellow. I run a team roller secondary, so the helix is different, but a 50/36 would be where I would start with a Polaris button clutch. Don't put bigger jets in it. As I said in my earlier post, I run 420's with a SLP pipe, SLP flowrites and air horn kit, V force3 reeds.

Don't run the SLP pipe with 500's or 470's you will be disappointed. The SLP pipe is good, but it makes less power than stock unless it is hot and it will never get there being that rich. This is documented by many different sources in this forum if you do some searching.

A variflow has a control knob that looks like this

[attachment=413007:IMAG010_Variflow.jpg]

The tempaflow looks like this

[attachment=413008:IMAG009_TempaFlow.jpg]

You can get installation instructions for either at http://www.holtzmaneng.com/
 

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is this a 02 700? If so the stock mains are 500. You cannot follow the 03 and up 700's as they have different calibration.
 

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is this a 02 700? If so the stock mains are 500. You cannot follow the 03 and up 700's as they have different calibration.[/b]
I was hoping someone was going to notice this. An 02 700 should NOT be run any leaner than 470s. The Tempaflow/Variflow leans it even more, so you have to jet up a bit. When you run these motors on the edge, you have to use good fuel...none of that crap left over from the lawn mowers!
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Well the sled had 560 mains in it when I bought it, and yes I have a vari-a-flow. But the knob is mounted to the top of the air box. So starting at 500's would be a good thing then?
 

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Well the sled had 560 mains in it when I bought it, and yes I have a vari-a-flow. But the knob is mounted to the top of the air box. So starting at 500's would be a good thing then?[/b]
I saw the mention of 420's in your original post and automatically assumed it was an '03, Sorry bout that. Go catch P-nut. Yes, I would probably go back to 500's or 490's and start from there. Make sure the v-flow is installed with the appropriate restrictors and go from there. Spent $20 or so on a bend a lite that you can inset into the spark plug hole and read piston wash. Several different site on the web that provide pics. I'll see if I can locate one and post up later
 

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Well the sled had 560 mains in it when I bought it, and yes I have a vari-a-flow. But the knob is mounted to the top of the air box. So starting at 500's would be a good thing then?[/b]
Well, I dont want to sound like a worry wart, but if the previous owner had jetted up from stock 500's to 560's there had to be a reason.
My guess is he either burned it down or saw white plugs, panicked, and then thru in the 560's. If it was my rig I'd throw the 560's back in it, set the needle clip to 4 and run it at mid-range and wot and read the plugs. Then gradually lean it down till yah get tan plugs and acceptable gas milage. :i_need_snow:
 

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I'd also check that boost bottle. It could be leaking, or leaking at the carb boots. I'd personally spend the money for two new carb boots and ditch the bottle...you dont need it. Its just inviting trouble, IMO.
 
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