Dead as a rock... - HCS Snowmobile Forums

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Old 04-14-2019, 01:12 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Join Date: Aug 2014
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Current Sled(s): 2015 Ski-Doo Renegade X 800 ETEC
Previous Sled(s): 2000 Polaris 700 SKS, 2010 Polaris IQ Turbo Dragon
Location: Wisconsin
Favorite Riding Area: Turtle Flambeau Flowage
19-20 Mileage:
18-19 Mileage: 2143
17-18 Mileage: 1565
16-17 Mileage: 1980
Age: 21
Riding Since: 2007
Default Dead as a rock...

So a few weeks back we head up for our last sled trip of the year. When we left the last trip, the reverse on my 2010 fst dragon wasn't working (wouldn't engage, but could hear it spinning i'm pretty sure) but it was starting and running just fine. Parked it, threw the cover on it and left. We get there, uncover it, turn the key AND: nothing. Zero signs of life. I figured maybe a ground was corroded or loose, or the wire under the seat rubbed through and was grounding out. Neither was the case. The starter solenoid was pretty corroded so I bought a new one and installed that. Nothing, even with a jump, so clearly the circuit is dead whether it's due to something grounding out or a bad relay. So that leaves me with the five relays, right? Start solenoid, chassis, efi, ignition relay, and the one over by the exhaust. One had a bit of corrosion on it (by exhaust), cleaned that, nothing. All the others look fine. I've heard condensation can build up inside and corrode what you can't see however.

Guess i'm just throwing this out there to ask if anyone thinks it is just relays, and if you need every relay to work in order for the sled to do anything? I mean this thing does nothing. No ecu, gauges, lights, start, click, whine, anything. We parked it running, and came back to that. If you have any other experiences please shoot some suggestions my way or im probably just gonna start buying relays.

Thanks y'all
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Old 04-14-2019, 08:58 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Current Sled(s): '11 IQ Turbo, '15 Axys 800, '19 850 XC
Previous Sled(s): '12 Pro-R 8, '08 IQ 8, '02 Pro-X
Location: Northwestern WI
Favorite Riding Area: Where the snow is....
19-20 Mileage:
18-19 Mileage: 5060
17-18 Mileage: 5100
16-17 Mileage: 2050
Age: 51
Riding Since: 1976
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Have you checked all the fuses to be sure something isn't blown? The ECU on those controls everything. If that doesn't have power, the sled would be completely dead. Didn't have a mouse get into something? Have an FST manual? It covers all the circuits in pretty good detail.
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Old 04-14-2019, 11:02 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Current Sled(s): 2015 Ski-Doo Renegade X 800 ETEC
Previous Sled(s): 2000 Polaris 700 SKS, 2010 Polaris IQ Turbo Dragon
Location: Wisconsin
Favorite Riding Area: Turtle Flambeau Flowage
19-20 Mileage:
18-19 Mileage: 2143
17-18 Mileage: 1565
16-17 Mileage: 1980
Age: 21
Riding Since: 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orville-x View Post
Have you checked all the fuses to be sure something isn't blown? The ECU on those controls everything. If that doesn't have power, the sled would be completely dead. Didn't have a mouse get into something? Have an FST manual? It covers all the circuits in pretty good detail.
I checked everything in the fuse/relay panel above the clutches and all other relays I could see. Don't have a manual, just going by sight. Maybe it's possible a mouse got into something, but it was still pretty cold out when this happened and it was only sitting for a week. I'll have to take out the fine toothed comb and look through to find every fuse I can. Off the top of my head though, I can't think of anything other than the fuse box and the stray relay near the exhaust.
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Old 04-15-2019, 07:45 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Current Sled(s): 2015 AXYS Pr-S SB Ann 800, 2019 Indy 850.
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Location: SE Lower Michigan
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19-20 Mileage: 715 so far
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Should be a simple step by step analysis.

1. Battery charged up?
2. Ignition switch getting 12V?
3. Ignition switch sending 12V?
4. Lights working?
5. Kill switch not pushed down?

If these all check out, then use a test light to trace 12V to each component.
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Old 04-15-2019, 11:35 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Current Sled(s): '11 IQ Turbo, '15 Axys 800, '19 850 XC
Previous Sled(s): '12 Pro-R 8, '08 IQ 8, '02 Pro-X
Location: Northwestern WI
Favorite Riding Area: Where the snow is....
19-20 Mileage:
18-19 Mileage: 5060
17-18 Mileage: 5100
16-17 Mileage: 2050
Age: 51
Riding Since: 1976
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Even with the kill switch pushed down, the MFD should still turn on when you attempt to crank the sled over. I agree with the suggestion to check over the ignition switch and those connections as a starting point. Note also that there are fusible links in the electrical system as well as fuses, so keep an eye for those also.
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Old 04-18-2019, 07:58 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Try switching your EFI relay with one of the other one and see if the sled powers up, pretty sure it will start without a chassis relay so maybe try switching those.
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Old 05-10-2019, 02:30 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Join Date: Aug 2014
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Current Sled(s): 2015 Ski-Doo Renegade X 800 ETEC
Previous Sled(s): 2000 Polaris 700 SKS, 2010 Polaris IQ Turbo Dragon
Location: Wisconsin
Favorite Riding Area: Turtle Flambeau Flowage
19-20 Mileage:
18-19 Mileage: 2143
17-18 Mileage: 1565
16-17 Mileage: 1980
Age: 21
Riding Since: 2007
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So ive been tracing current. Key switch good, current through three relay plug ins (not the relays, but the female terminals in the fuse box themselves) start solenoid, chassis, efi relay. But when i get to ignition relay i dont get current, my light doesnt light up even with key turned to start position. That normal? Doesn’t seem like it to me.
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Old 05-11-2019, 07:46 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Location: SE Lower Michigan
Favorite Riding Area: Cadillac, Gaylord
19-20 Mileage: 715 so far
18-19 Mileage: 849
17-18 Mileage: 1280
16-17 Mileage: 1115
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I'd trace that 12V feed wire backwards to where it gets power. It may come from one of the other relays.

You also need to determine whether each relay is getting activated and is delivering 12V out.

Relays are activated by an internal coil that must
be grounded as well as sent 12V power from somewhere.

You can test relays using jumper wires to activate them and feed 12V to their inputs so you can see the test light illuminate at the output terminal.

You really need a wiring diagram to make tracing easier.
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Old 07-08-2019, 05:42 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 250
Current Sled(s): 2015 Ski-Doo Renegade X 800 ETEC
Previous Sled(s): 2000 Polaris 700 SKS, 2010 Polaris IQ Turbo Dragon
Location: Wisconsin
Favorite Riding Area: Turtle Flambeau Flowage
19-20 Mileage:
18-19 Mileage: 2143
17-18 Mileage: 1565
16-17 Mileage: 1980
Age: 21
Riding Since: 2007
Default

Just a quick update, haven't been able to spend much time on it. Fusible links I checked, all are good. The only things I haven't checked is that the relays themselves are all functioning, and I haven't traced the ignition relay wiring to see why it isn't getting 12V when I turn the key. I examined all of the wiring down the by ecu, grounds, connections, looked for any rubbed spots or fraying and there was nothing.

One question I have is do ECU's fail? Is that a possibility/anybody have that happen? I have a spare ECU I'm tempted to throw in just to check.

I also don't have a wiring diagram, which makes things a bit more difficult.
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Old 07-08-2019, 05:57 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Age: 40
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its been a few years since I worked on my FSTs (I had 2 of them in the past). I do remember them having wire chaffing issues up where the harness passes by the handlebar neck or post, next to the top cowling cover.
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