Hi all, I have a standard z1 turbo coming in the fall.I was planing to install 153 studs in the stock hacksaw,but now i'm wondering if I'd be better off with a 1.25 cobra or ripsaw.I mostly trail ride but I know I'm gonna' have to line em' up!(EVERYONE is going to want a shot at this thing!) I don't want to stud a 1.25 track,I know,alot of people do it,just not me.What do you think would be better for lake racing,studded 1 inch or unstudded 1.25? Yea,I know there are alot of variables,but in geneal,what do you think? Thanks alot! Jay

If your only going to use the sled as lake racer go 1" with chisel studs, if you going mostly trail riding go 1-1/4 and don't be afraid of the studs.

If the 1" track is anything like the Mach Z track, it should hook up awesume in any condition.
If you're not going to stud the 1 1/4" track, then for sure stick with the 1" and stud it.
With that kind of power, you will be coming into corners faster, you will be running harder and you will really need the extra safty of a studded track.
It's not worth taking any chances, you will be much happier with running studs in that sled.
Most of the time you can get by without studs but when you come into that one icy corner a little hard or need to shut it down fast, you will be thankful you have studs in the track.
Three years ago I saw a guy slide through an icy corner without studs and his sled went over a 40'-50' drop.
Luckly he bailed but his sled was shot after bouncing down the hill, hitting trees like a pin ball machine.
Many years ago I never thought I needed studs either, I thought I only need the one stud on the seat, (me), until I flipped it on an icy corner and broke my colar bone. never again. That was a heck of a wake up call for me.
I run studs in all my sleds, even the 440 fans that my wife and kids have rode in the past.
Keep the 1" track, stud it up the middle and enjoy a happy and safe season!
Thank snow!

stay the heck away from that cobra... that track is a major pos.. your better off running the old 1.375/13.5 firecat track for traction and durabilty.

Why is the Cobra track a pos?

I put over 5,000 miles on my 1.375 firecat track on my 03 f7 and never ever had any troubles with the lugs and it hooked hard...the lugs are stiff and very durable on those tracks and anybody will tell you they hook hard... when i first saw the cobra in person I grabbed onto the lug and it was soft and flexible and I thought to myself oh shit oh shit, that aint good!! and then when I bought my f1000 I noticed it did NOT hook nearly as hard as it should ( the damn lugs fold over) and then sure shit not even after a 1,000 miles the lugs started ripping off and now after 2500 miles the damage is very significant.. now bear in mind I'm a throttle jockey but damn it I never had no problems on my firecat track, not even one tear in any lug after 5,000 plus miles of low snow riding and now all of a sudden with the cobra track(we had an awsome snow year this year in my area by the the way) I have an entire track that is chewed and rippped all to hell after one season with half the mileage.. and while the pics on cats warranty page for the dealers that need guidlelines to follow to determine eligibility for track warranty might have held true for tracks in the past it is not fair of them to use those guidelines for this pos track that the cobra is and my dealer also sent pics of my track to the warranty dept. and they refused so I have to eat a track on my brand new 12k sled and I'm not happy about it either not that I would really want another cobra anyways and doubt I could deal on another track anyways.. I bought the sled in good faith and did not budget for track replacement on my dime the first season out due to something like this.. tell ya what, I'll go snap a picture and post it when I get time so you can see what I'm talking about..

I mean don't get me wrong, the cobra no doubt will hook harder then a 1 inch but she aint shit compared to the old 1.375 and I will more then likely be using the old firecat track if I replace it..

and maybe you will never see a problem with the cobra and I guess some have not but I sure did.

Let's just put it this way, the track is in bad enough shape that in a dealer trade they would be forced to deduct $800+ off the sled and this pisses me off as it is NOT my fault. not that ANY dealers in my area are even the least bit interested in taking a 08 arctic cat in trade anyways..

but other then that and the questionable top speed of the machine under certain conditions the sled has been flawless but this track deal really rubbed me the wrong way.

I'm just really bummed out about it.. these tracks are cheaply built but cost lots of $$$ to replace and it is a safety issue and I'm pretty sure i will just run next season and see what happens as cat seems to have no interest in dealing with it. Apparently the cost of a new track is a lot of $$ to them and somehow they must think I will swallow this.. !! It is the principal of the matter now more then anything.. Maybe I'm just not the kind of customer they are interested in dealing with which is fine by me.. I'm damn positive that this cobra track lug issue has surfaced in there testing.. if it hasn't then they need to hire some guys to test rride that ride a little harder then joe smoe maybe?.

Was your track studded? If not it should be covered under warranty. I took the 1.375 track off my ZR and replaced it with a 1.25 Ripsaw which is a great track.

There is a single ply Cobra coming out, if your Cobra disintegrated I wonder what will happen to the single ply.

no studs. I think you mis-understand though, I will get pics to show you.. my lugs are cutting and ripping off and in many,many places.. the lugs are very thin and soft and flexible on the cobra track.. the lugs on the old firecat 1.375 track were stiff and strong and thick and durable just like you would expect them to be to paddle snow and live during normal trail use and hold up,just the opposite on the cobra.

go down to your dealer and look at the cobra track and feel the lugs,bend on them with your fingers.. you will see instantly that they will have no durability. there is no way they can unless you ride like grandpa in deep powder snow only.

here is some pics for ya vince, I got lugs ripping off on the ends of the track in the middle of the track and all the way around the track, some lugs are gone entirely and others are just have chunks torn off some are half gone and others are torn clean off, some lugs that are in tact that have the crack marks that are going to rip off eventually,,, I've never seen anything like it..

I just went out and snapped a couple quick pics for ya so ya got an idea of what ya might be up against. oh and by the way, not a single track clip missing.

WOW,one case studs might help durability of a track,less spinning! Jay

I'd send a letter to customer service, it looks like the track is starting to come apart between the lugs. If your dealer backs you strongly the track should be replaced.
Also remember some dealers are not crazy about doing jobs like that track replacement because the book time is so tight on warranty work.

I don't know how much of a weight savings it would be but my dealer was going to put the 14" track on for just labor. I would think if it's going to mostly a lake sled that would be a good track, But I wouldn't want to take that sled off trail.

I'm probably going to push the issue some more, as far as installing the track, I'd rather do that myself then have the dealer do it.

it is against the law to run studs where I ride.

Not trying to piss off anyone but purely from a performance stand point the Cobra is the best all around track I've had easily!!!

Better then the 1-1/4 predator, 1-1/4 ripsaw, 1-3/8 sno-pro F7, and any 1" track I have ever owned. It simply does everything excellent where as all the other tracks I mentioned have good points but also are poor in other areas!!

Mine looks great but it only has 1000 miles on it....maybe things will go bad after some more miles but it doesn't appear that way as of yet.

I never noticed any trouble on mine until after 1000 miles and then things just got progressively worse after each ride. It started out as just one lug then 2 lugs then 3 and then pretty soon it was lugs all the way around..

I'd keep an eye on it. Hopefully, mine is an isolated case. But I don't think so. It could be the fact that the track just wasn't designed for an agressive driver too, which I am. But then it should not be on a sno pro either IMO.. I buy my sled to raise a little hell and I've never had a track issue before in all my years of riding. maybe my luck finally run out?

I agree the cobra is an awesome track, but it does have one down fall HARDPACK ICE/SNOW the below ZERO kind, other than that its great!

the cobra is very agressive I have 3000 miles on mine !

I think you have either been lucky on other tracks, are not used to riding with this much power, or have your suspension set up to not transfer enough weight. it looks like that damage is caused by excessive spinning, over rocks stumps etc..

Jet, I have an 08 F1000 nightfire and my track did the samething except your looks way better than mine did! I took it to my dealer and got my dealer to send the pics of the track to his rep and Cat paid for me to get a new Cobra track. The only thing is that my track was studded and my dealer charged me for taking the studs out of my old track and put in the new track and all the labour to change the track. Even though Cat gave me a new track it still costed me $450 after the studs were takin off the one track and put on the other and the labour to change the track!

Now the new track I have is doing the samething again. I love the Cobra track for the traction but man it is really pissing me off!

I was affraid that there might be others out there with a similar problem. Mine is ripping more lugs on every ride. I have some lugs that are not gone yet but you can see where they will go because you can bend on them and the rubber is cracked.

I don't think there is any point in me putting another cobra on no matter who pays for it. The only trouble is I am not going to put on another track that doesn't work as well for traction nor will I be taming down my riding style as if I do either of those then the sled is no good to me. I think I will just run this sled for another season and get rid of it, she will have over 5,000 miles on her this time next year anyways.. or possibly trade this fall, I'll just have to deduct $500 off the price for the shit track when I sell this sled.

I'm affraid now if I go into the dealer again with it and complain that they will treat me like a dumb kid who just burned the tires off his brand new mustang and wants another pair for free and just never mind the fact that the f7 which I just put 6,000 miles on never had a track lug problem ever and the f7 was a much faster sled to boot.

I'm glad your dealer went to bat for you and I'm sorry to hear that you are having the same trouble all over again. I really don't think the track is of good quality or design for longevity and do believe had I had this cobra track on my f7 that I would have experienced problems and do believe that had cat just used the same track they used on my f7 on my f10 that I wouldn't have any problems.

I hate to bitch but I figured what the hell, might as well let people know what my experience was and maybe some others who had problems would speak up to.. just so the guys that are putting down there hard earned cash on these things can make a little more informed choice on what to do and not have any surprises.

I think we will see even more complaints on this cobra track next season, especially on the even more powerful and heavier turbo..

My old f7 would kick this sleds ass so I'm pretty sure it isn't the power part.

Jet, you may think that your F7 was as fast as your F1000 but your F1000 I bet you any $ would be faster. I had an 04 F7 nightfire for 4 years that I kept completely stock and now I have an 08 F1000 Nightfire that is completely stock and when I first got on the F1000 I thought that it didn't feel that much faster. But my cousiin who lives beside me has an 03 F7 lined up beside me in the field or on the lake, my F1000 beat his F7 so bad out of the hole and would continue to pull away bad. I literally could give the F7 about 4 sled length head start on the lake from a dead stop and be by the F7 by the time I hit 50-60 mph and I'm not joking. I also have another friend that has an 05 F7 with some mods (not sure what) and the results were the same as when I lined up against the 03 F7. The fastest I ever had my F1000 (top end) this winter was 110 mph on really good conditions on a lake but any other time it would usually only do 105 mph and I thought that it wasn't that great but then when I had to chance to take my F1000 to a radar run where there was no resistance, it ran 118.6 mph and 119.2 mph. I was so impressed and no other stock sled except one other F1000 was that fast!

So the power of the F1000's may very well be the problem why the Cobra are having problems. The FSeries chassis really does a good job at making the sled feel slower than it really is when compared to the Firecat chassis.

My f10 runs the same way, on really good conditions I can see 110 and on so,so conditions 105 is the norm.. never tried glare ice because I don't have studs but believe you if you say they will reach 120, it makes sense. My f7 just wasn't as picky and to get mid teens out of it on hard pack was never an issue. and the f7 had much better traction from 0-80 IMO.With my f10 I have to be really careful racing even 600's cause if the track spins I'm screwed,especiall if the 600 let's off at under 90 and don't give me a chance to reel them in... the old f7 i could line em up on any condition and come out on top. The old firecat could really put that power to the ground.

I just don't like the torn lugs on my cobra.. it irritates me. cause i have never had a track problem on a sled before and if anything I ride easier then I use to not harder.

cat has pretty much admitted the power problem though by releasing the crossfire r and the turbo pklus releasing the speed kits and the comments they have made in pride and the tips and suggestions to pull more top end out of them.. but I seriously question the judgment of cat to use the torn lug prone cobra on a sled as powerful as this turbo is suppose to be and then factor in the extra weight of the turbo sled.. I think some guys are going to be bumming next season with torn lugs on the cobra track and the 08's equipped with cobras will see more miles next season and the problems of this track should show up more next year. it is a spendy track to replace.

we will see but bet I am right. if they ride like we do they will see issues

Don't be afraid to stud a 1.25. I have a 1.25 Ripsaw on a Turbo Touring studding the center belt only with 1.325 studs and Double backers. One double backer per pitch and it hooks up nice with good stopping ability. I run this thing hard and with 4200 miles on it, I did not have any pull thru's. Busted a couple studs here and there, but very happy with this set up.

Sorry you have had such bad luck with the Cobra. I put 2300 on mine and had no problems at all. Of course mine is studded and I am just running a Jag. You must really hammer on it.

Also, Where in the heck do you ride in Minnesota where it is illegal to ride with studs? I ride all over the state and the only place that is a hassle is the Paul Bunyan trail around Brainerd. It is only illegal on paved trails and most of them have some sort of unpaved side trail or alternate route. Once you stud you will never go back.

for lake racing go with the 1 inch hacksaw track it is a very fast track from my experience. I am assuming you are concerned about top end speed for the most part on hard pack? Good for the trail also. If in the powder is your thing go with the bigger track.

That is where you are wrong..... the Hacksaw is a SHIT trail track!!! Maybe if you use studs it will be fine, but without it is SHIT!!!!!

he said he was studding it. I agree it is not a great track in the snow. If you read the first post he is asking about lake racing and the hacksaw is a very fast track top end.

Lake racing it wold probably be fine.

I've never had a cobra. I watched the "SledHead 24/7" or whatever it is show on today today, maybe it was a re-run I'm not sure, but they reviewed many of the 09 sleds and the AC guy kept saying that the Cobra on the turbo is a "single ply" track -to reduce weight. is that true? Were the '07 cobra's single ply? that can't be good for stud options.

There was no Cobra in 07.

Some manufacturer will come up with a stud that has a shorter shoulder. Not only will that single ply track be lighter it should have less rolling resistance, that frees up HP getting to the snow.

yes, I miss spoke. I know it was new for 08, but for 09 it is now single ply?

Stud Boy makes a stud that was designed for th 08 REVXP with it's single ply track........i'm sure the cobra will require this same stud or they will be working on a new one for it.

I've seen the short studboy studs for the XP, all backer and head...not much stud. That won't work for me. I'll have to swap in a heavier track and loose 10hp.