Smith Marine outside of Old Forge has been dropping some hints to friends of mine about the 800 E-Tech for 'Mid-year' intro next season. Have any of the Doo faithfull heard similar rumblings from there Dealers ??

Never heard anything about a mid-season 800 e-tech, but probably a 2010 800 e-tech. I have mixed feelings about the e-tech, sure it has awesome fuel economy and clean emissions, but if you want to mod and tune a sled with that sophisticated of a fuel injection system.........good luck.

I test rode the 600 etech on Saturday and much prefer the performance of the 600 SDI which is by far peppier than the test model I rode. This inspite of all the hoopla I've heard from BRP reps and dealers. I found the 1200 4 stroke to be a much better performer - more responsive better torque, smoother. I'd hold off the celebrations on the e-tech for a bit.

I'm buying an 800 R for 09.

I totally agree with your statement. I test rode both last weekend and walked away with the same feelings. The dealer let us take the etec a few weeks ago for the entire day and i wasn't impressed with it's power vs the SDI..I ordered the 1200X

Biggest thing about Etech is the emissions and fuel/oil consumption. I'm sure they'll be tweaking away all spring/summer to get a little more performance out of the engine.

This has got me re-thinking the E-Tech 600 'gade........??? given my size 6'-1" , 240 lbs the 800 might make more sense, Is the 800 carbed or fuel injected ?? what kind of mileage can one expect ?

Get the 800, it has smart carbs so it always runs crisp and gets as good of mileage as anything else short of the E Tech. Depending on how you ride it you can expect anywhere from 12-20MPG, I have never seen anywhere near 20 but it can be done. With all that mapping issues Doo, Poo, & Cat have had with the injection sleds I'm happy to stick with the carbs.

From what I've gathered doing an 800 with the E Tech may not be all that easy, something to do with and injection issue. I guess the 600 is pushing the limits of fuel delivery in the current system. Then again this is just hearsay.

Thanks for the reply DooSkiX !! Do you feel the clutching / Belt issues with the 800's have been rectified ?? I was led to believe it was a combination of poor cooling and alignment issues, etc ? or was it more within the secondary ??

According to Doo they have fixed the problem, the issue was with the vendor supplying the motor mounts. There's a release from BRP floating around that states they they have changed vendors and will monitor this closely, at least they admitted the problem so one would hope it will be fixed. Not all of the sleds had this problem so I'd buy the story.

The heat issue is most definitely an alignment problem, can be easily fixed by shimming the secondary. I really didn't have any issues with premature belt wear.

What I've heard from an inside source at BRP is they currently have an 800 E-Tec but it will not meet EPA standards. The rumor going around BRP is they may be dropping the 800 motor all together and the new 4-Tec 1200 would be the replacement. Should be interesting to see what happens with everyone needing to meet all the new EPA standards.

I thought emissions was a "cafe" requirement, therefore not every sled in the stable had to meet it ??

Now why wouldnt an E-Tech not meet emmisions and a carbed 800 meet them? That makes no sence.The old 800 sdi would have met the emmisions.

ski-doo wouldn't drop the 800 altogether, it's a huge seller. Just my opinion.

The EPA standards go up every few years and they need to have so many sleds that can meet the new standard. My friend at Doo wasn't saying for sure that the 800 would be dropped but it has been talked about. Actually the 600's are their biggest sellers which is the same for most manufacturers. Don't shoot the messenger. The 800 has different fuel requirements than the 600 E-Tec which needs 500 PSI just to run the injectors so maybe their having issues with fuel delivery. You guys that are waiting for the 800 E-Tec to come out are you also waiting for the next fastest computer to come out? If they do make an 800 E-Tec then you'll say well give them a year or 2 to get the bugs worked out then maybe I'll buy one. Then after a few years go by you'll hear a rumor about the next hot sled coming so will you say hmmm maybe they'll make that so I think I'll wait for that......hell if I did that I'd still be riding my 1971 Rupp 440 Sprint SS, just buy something and ride it. I need a sled so I'm buying something this year either the XP 800 or XR 1200.

I am debating on what to get for my next sled as well..

for those that have a Gade 800R, how do you like it? That is what I think I am going to get...

Smith Marine doesn't exist, it's been Old Forge Powersports for years now, and who was dropping these "hints"?

I think it is unrealistic to have the attitude that every new rendition of a given motor has to be more powerful and faster than the last. 120 HP from the E-tec is a very reasonable output for a 600. With the EPA breathing down our necks, I think the emphasis has been diverted to clean efficient reasonable power as opposed to ever increasing HP. We can't have 25 MPG and record breaking HP in the same engine.

If the 800 comes out as an E-tec, there is no reason to think that it will be any faster. If it is converted to direct injection it will be for the sole purpose of satisfying EPA requirements, which the present engine probably doesn't do beyound 2010.

I think it is sad when I hear the main reason for buying a 4-stroke is because people are tired of the 2-strokes self distructing. Could it be we are simply pushing too much HP out of the 2-strokes? Expecting too much! To the point that they are not reliable or at the least, need frequent rebuilds. Would it not make more sense to back off a little and trade off some HP for more reliable, fuel efficient, cleaner engines. There is nothing inherently wrong with the 2-stroke and BRP is proving they can be just at efficient and clean as a 4-stroke. Their light weight and simple design makes them ideal for use in a snowmobile. It would be sad to see them disappear just because we expect them to be developing HP beyound the reasonable limits of their design.

I am not totally against 4-strokes, but if a 2-stroke will get the same job done with less weight and moving parts, what is the point of the 4-stroke?

You're right, but then again, given my "old age" I was reffering to the "former" since I go back to a time long before you were born !!

Points well made Charles, I agree. Given todays big $$ for sled purchases I would like to see increased emphasis on reliability !

Good point, my dad still calls it smith marine sometimes, so you're not alone.

2010

charles. agreed.for example a 60hp fan will go forever.

The name Smith Marine might just appear again in old forge. Sooner than one might think. Time will tell!

I happen to know you might be right !!!!!

There is more of a percentage of people who want big horsepower over 25mpg. YEah everyone wants 200hp with 25mpg, but just not going to happen. What the 4 major brands have to do is have about 4 or 5 makes and just nail each one down. Have a touring, long track, crossover, and a racer. IF you want to make it different add acc. hoods, shocks, suspensions, etc. Have a sled that gets 25 mph 100hp. Have a sled 200hp 12mpg.

I happen to know you both ARE right. Just didn't want to say anything until it was official.

BRP was no way letting that franchise fall into unkown hands .. once more.
Anything would be an improvment...progress moves on .!

Well it's in good hands now, i can't say enough good about the service we've received from Doug in the past, even when it was OFPS we dealt almost exclusively with him and Johnny and we've never had reason to complain.

I too am waiting to see if there will be an 800 Etech. I would like to switch to doo. However, I don't want to lose the fuel injection (mostly because of the light throttle pull). A guy really gets spoiled by that after awhile and that's pretty much all I've ever rode. And I don't want to go from a 800 to a 600. Hard to go backwards in HP. So I guess I'm just going to wait and cross my fingers that they come out with one. I always thought they would bring out a 800 SDI but they never did.

I hear ya. I went from a 2005 Sabercat 700 to a '08 renegade 800R. Personally I love the 800R as it is a much more refined sled than the Sabercat except that the throttle pull killed me at first. But I did get used to it. I would compare the 800r to the Sabercat as a street legal ferrari to a nascar series dodge. Both wicked fast and fun to drive (ride).

LBD

Fuel injection definately doesn't mean fuel economy. My F6 is a perfect example of that. That EFI dumps more fuel into that engine than I ever thought imaginable. But the comments about the light throttle pull are dead on....it is soooo nice compared to carbed sleds.

Also, I'm not so sure that they would have that much problem with getting the etec injection to run on the 800. I have a boat with an ETEC so I've been studying this technology for a while now. They have 60 HP all the way to 250 HP ETECs so I'm fairly certain they could make this work. Now, can they make it meet fuel standards set by the EPA? Maybe not. You just might need to feed those big cans so much fuel to keep them from leaning out too much that it won't meet it. What they might have to do is go back to 3 cylinder 2-strokes in the 700cc + range to get them to work. Smaller cylinders don't need so much fuel/air. Thoughts to chew on....

By the way....how the hell did we ever elect a government that passed these stupid laws for snomobiles???? Be careful who your voting for!