we all know that some fuses are faster than others. I am wondering if the type of fuel we use plays a big roll on the speed and economy of these sleds.

I have a fuse that does about 105-107 top speed on a 3/4 mile lake on packed snow

My GFs sled runs about 99 on the same lake (hers has alot less transfer dialed into it)

These run a premium non-reformulated gas. I wonder if the reformated stuff will lean these out a little and allow the people that are getting 115+ out of them.

I might have to do a test next season with "milwaukee RFG" and "kelly lake NRFG" next season

Great question + possibility.

We run 93+ Mobil. I'm at 113-114mph ideal fast conditions. 05 900 Fuse.
I am in northeast (NH) and I believe we have typical oxygenated fuel, but no ethanol stuff.
I have not touched suspension or anything yet. 100% stock. No snow last year to play with stuff. 144 studs.
206 or so miles on odometer.

cfm, what is oxygenated fuel that is not ethonol? are you using mtbe? I thought there was a federal ban on that.

We are using non oxygenated fuel, but milwaukee has two reformulated blends, a summer and a winter blend.

I just looked up your state and I noticed that you are now getting away from mtbe and moving to ethanol. That is happening (or did) this year. You will be in the same shape as us, you will have either regular gas (which may or may not have ethanol) and RFG which will have ethanol.

If they (the government) want to screw with this they need to make one fuel standard for the whole nation to eleminate these "specialty blends" and stop adding to these high gas prices becuase of distubution costs..

My question still lingers.

Lamby, I hope this helps;

Polaris stated back in the spring of 05 (during their town-hall "blow smoke up our asses" meeting)
That the sled was mapped to run on 10% ethanol fuel. and that performance differences were seen between pure gasoline and alcohol blends.

They said nothing about the reformulated fuel though (before anyone ask's, Reformulated, and 10% ethanol are different)

Up where I am at, it was difficult to find fuel that contained ethanol, (it is different now) So, if you are in a reformulated area I would wait to fuel til you get out of there and get the real stuff without the ether in it.

I have seen many cars get a check-engine light from switching from RFG to non RFG fuels. It was a catalytic converter code that cleared with no work needed.

as for RFG, the stuff gives me a migraine whenever I get into the RFG areas. or it could just be the people that live there that cause headaches?

NH only has 10% ehtanol in the several southern counties mandated by the EPA to do so....we are talking about Strafford, Rockingham and Hillsboro. From the Lakes Region north it is straight gas (no ethanol or MTBE).

Should be that way throughout the winter. However, as with MTBE (which was never mandated for the northern half of the State) ethanol will creep north as it becomes easier for distributors to deal with just one type of gas. This occurs when the price differential between the two blends equalizes.

Anyway, just check the pump. It is federal law that any pump dispensing 10% ethanol clearly displays so on the pump. Down here in Strafford county all the pumps are so marked.

As for your original question, it depends on who you talk to. I know this winter geography will force me to be switching back and forth between to the fuels. I will be very interested in the results!

As a sidenote, my sled is in the shop getting the E/S bolt recall and the fuel sender replacement. I am curious as to the possibility that ethanlo laced fuel could possibly aggravate or accelerate the fuel unit disinigration? Just food for thought....

Skip

No markings on pump. In fact, no boots on nozzle or anything - just like old gas stations. LOL.
I guess we have regular fuel. I was under impression we had oxygenated fuel, but I never really looked into it.
BTW: I'm over in Moultonboro.

So, regular fuel it is. Thanks.

Why can't I go edit my post above ?

guys....the best fuel for any sled is CHEVRON PREMIUM with TECHNOLENE(sp?) if ya can find it. SUNOCO 94 2nd best. try the chevron stuff you'll like it

I work at a road course race track, they sell race fuels. The question is would it be worth mixing some in with the Sunoco preimum 93 fuel with the 10% ethonol that i presently use? I can get 100, 112 and 114. I would most likely want to use this when drag racing on the lake, If it would be, what type and what ratio would be appropriate to see some performance gains.
Its a 05 Fusion 900 engin pretty much stock.

Actually running higher octane fuels does nothing to help performance on a non-modified sled, it will cost you performance.

To take advantage of higher octane rated fuels you would need to increase compression and advance your timing. The sled is designed to run on 87-92 octane fuels, you will see a difference between those two octane ratings on an injected sled.

In case you were not aware of how this works out and think higher octane gives better performance just by itself read this;

The Cleanfire engine operating system (ECM) is able to determine fuel quality by advancing the timing until detonation is detected, and the ECM determines what the fuel quality is from what amount of leanness and advance it was able to dial in before detecting the detonation, the ECM then selects a predetermined fuel and ignition map that is compatible for that fuel. This resets every time the sled is re-started.

So if you are running 87 octane fuel, the ECM will not add as much advance and it will run the engine richer.
Which will lead to poor economy and lack of performance.

Running octane rated fuels over 93 octane may cause hard start issues, unburnt fuel exiting the ports and burning off in the pipe, or raw fuel getting vented to the atmosphere.
Avgas (110 Low-Lead, dyed light blue)is the worst thing you could run in an injected sled besides maybe E-85 or diesel fuel.

If we could access the mapping of this sled to advance the timing and lean out the engine then the benefit of higher octane rated fuels would be seen and felt. But Higher compression would also be needed to fully take advantage of the higher octane fuels resistance to detonation.

I will look for a site to explain this better, and to explain the difference between Motor octane, and the average octane ratings shown at the pumps (yes there is a huge difference)

Thanks for the Octane class that was very informing, I would be vey interested in any other information on this subject you may find
Thanks Again!

all i run is 91,92,93 whatyever the premium is. and yes race fuel will not gain u anything in a stock sled. most stock sleds are under 13to 1 comp. i was told by the guy that bullt me some sled enginges that anbything under 13 to 1 93 oct is good. although a fuse is 14to 1 stock it was designed to rum on crap.

Thats really a generalization, and can change with porting, pipe design, ignition timing, and engine load. You could make a 12:1 2 stroke require 110, or like Polaris did, a 14:1 motor run on 87.

ya that true. but it is the same guy that built your indyhead 660 though. when he did head mods on my 700 he usally kept it just under 13 to1. usally around 12;85 or so. and those sleds would run on 93 all day with no probs. but i see your point.

G2O that was a great post. But what about the oxyigenates that they add now adays? I know all my 2 stroke gear (chainsaws, leafblowers, weedwackers) have to have the mixture adjusted to keep them running right with these different blends and straight fuel.

I would love to get a hack into that mapping software and adjust my own fuel curves.

RFG causes problems with 2-stokers becuase it actually contains ether (the product in Starting fluid) on a chainsaw or weed-whacker the problems do not show as soon as a higher compression engine under a load. I will look through my favorites list ( big list) to get a link to you guys explaining what is actually happening with RFG and also octane ratings that are higher then needed.

I used to think (back 20 years ago) that Octane rating meant "Power rating" too. when basically all it means is it's resistance to spontaneously combust prematurely under pressure. Now on the other hand, if you have a "DET" light flashing at you, the first thing to try is fuel with a higher octane rating.

As for hacking into the ECM, the boondocker control box is as close as we can get so far. Stay away from the intake sensor fooler unit. All it does is make the ECM think it is warmer out then it really is, and it makes the ECM run the air/fuel ratio leaner.

Here are a couple of links to help explain what octane ratings actually mean and how to determine what you need without wasting money on more expensive fuels;

But please google this subject too to learn as much as you can.

By the way, Briggs & Stratton ( A nice Milwaukee company ) has issued a warning that RFG is not compatible with their 2-stroke engines and warns of it's use. Harley davidson has also lobbied the EPA to put a warning on pumps that have RFG because it also damages their engines. There is a 2% loss in mileage using RFG so more fuel is burned to get the same distance as normal fuel, and the pollution effects of RFG are lost at that point. so, more expensive to get less mileage and actually cause more polution than burning non-RFg fuel. Hmmm, our Govt. hard at work again!

http://www.prime-mover.org/Engines/GArticles/octane.html