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Old 04-02-2004, 12:00 PM   #1 (permalink)
BrrEz0223
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I am torn on what to think or believe about the CK3 chassis sleds such as Formula III, Mach 1 and Mach Z ... I would consider buying one but I am not a strictly lake rider, how are these sleds on the trails? reliability? and what the hell is the difference between the Formula III 700 and a Mach 1 ( 700 only ). I just want to know out of the Formula III and Mach 1's what are the best years for these and best engines they had in that specific year, I like the purple and yellow, and I like the all black and red of the 1999 and 2000 Mach 1, but I have had bad BADDD! experiences with tripples ( 1997 ZRT 800 blew up the first day I used it, I bought it the night before -used- and it burned a hole in the piston... after the dealer fixed it for almost $800 bucks, the engine seized and I was without a sled for the YEAR !!! )
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Old 04-02-2004, 12:09 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Current Sled(s): 2012 switchback assault
Previous Sled(s): 2011 sitchback assault, 2009 apex gt ltx, fusions 700, pro x
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11-12 Mileage: 980
10-11 Mileage: 5200 miles
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I can't comment on the Formula III or the Mach 1, but a buddy of mine has a 2000 mach Z and it has never given him any problems. It has 6500 miles on it and runs great. I was suprised as to how well he could keep up with my pro x 600 on tight and twisty trails. The only time he would get way behind is when the tails got real bumpy or very tight and technical. I have spent lots of miles on his sled and overall like it for smooth, fast trails and lakes. One thing to keep in mind is that he puts at least ten bucks more gas in his sled at every fill up then i do on my 600! Good luck on deciding :beerchug:
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Old 04-02-2004, 02:22 PM   #3 (permalink)
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FIII 700 = Triple Cylinder 700 Engine, Single Pipe, VM Carbs
Mach 1 = Triple Cylinder 700 Engine, Triple Pipes

In 1998 the Mach 1 had VM Carbs, 99-up they were TM Flatslides.

The triple pipes added about 20 hp and about 20 lbs. I have a 97 Mach 1, a friend has a 99 Mach 1, another friend has a 98 FIII 700, and I also know and have ridden with people with other years of the Machs and FIII's. Racing side by side, we are all pretty much even. Whoever hooks up the best wins. The 98 FIII 700 is way fast w/ only a HRP clutch kit and gutted airbox. The FIII seems lighter in the trails than the Mach 1 of the same year.

Basically, the 97 and 98 700 triples were the problem child as far as the Doo triples go. There's an oil hole in the case that wasn't drilled, and resulted in a lot of toasted bearings. There was a recall at the time, but I think it was limited to those engines under warranty where a failure happened. But have also heard of people getting them fixed for free or cheaply over the last couple years. Would definately be worth a visit to your local doo dealer with the sled's VIN#. (can also check service history..)

There are also a bunch of people out there with a TON of trouble free times on their 98 Mach 1's and 98 FIII 700's (I met a guy a few weeks ago in the UP with a 98 Mach 1 with 45,000 miles on it, w/out a rebuild...) So, you can take the triple crank bearing failure argument for whatever you want...

Also, the 1998 CKIII's were known for electrical problems. My friend's 98 FIII 700 has very dim dash lights, and blows headlights every once in a while. The wiring harnesses, grounds, stator, and CDI have all been replaced a couple of times. Other than that, the sled runs great, and he has just over 5000 miles on it.

That said, if it were me, I would look for a 1999-up Mach 1, FIII 700, FIII 800, or a Mach Z. That will get you the most dependable triple that Doo makes. I would look at the FIII 700 for trail riding, or one of the Mach's if top speed is more your thing.

Hope this helps...

Jim
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Old 04-02-2004, 02:52 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Thanks so much, you answered all my questions, very well explained, I was also thinking about a 1999 Formula III 600, how well do those do?
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Old 04-02-2004, 05:31 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I have a '99 FIII 800 (see pic under name) and it works perfect. In the rough trails it isn't the best, but on fast trails that are relatively smooth it just flys!

As for the Gas issues, my 800 burns ~$4-5 less than my brothers pro X 600 ('03)
On the lake if I get traction it isn't a contest, in deeper snow the depper lug track on it will hook up better than mine, but I can still beat him from 90mph on up. (it is even from 40mph to 90.

Overall I like it
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Old 04-03-2004, 10:35 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Most of the trash talk around here with the heavy triples is way over-exagerated.

I went from an Indy 500 to a 00 Mach Z thinking I was in for a workout, but it wasn't nearly as bad as I thought.

I think on nice trails my Mach Z outhandles my Indy 500(1996,not XC).

The bumps are abruptly annoying sometimes, but that the price you pay for a smooth, powerful, gut-wrenching acceleration triple.

The formula lll's are great machines. The CK3 FIII 600 was many editors first choice sled. Id had the triple pipes, and performance was awesome for a 600cc machine.

You can pick up FIII's very cheap, and for about a grand worth of upgrades, you could have one mean missle.
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Old 04-03-2004, 11:03 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I would stay away from the Mach 1, though it may be faster then the Formula III I just dont like the whole 20lbs more thing, I really REALLY wish I could find a 2000 Formula III 700, I just love the graphics on it and that was the last year of the CK-3 Chassis Formula, I just like the looks I guess, plus I'd rather have a 2000 then a 1999, I dont like the 98's and I hear they have mass problems, I actually have a 1996 Indy 500 right now, and I dont mind the sled in the bumps at all, but how would one of these formulas compare as far as the ride goes?, what would a Formula III 600 be able to beat, and what would a Form III 700 be able to beat? I would love to find a 99-00 Formula III, with 2000 miles or less, that would be Ideal but how much should I spend at most on one of these ??? and what should I be careful of? I cannot get a MACH, insurance reasons, I am 18.
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Old 04-04-2004, 04:43 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Mine is a 800 and it would have been around $2500-$3000 American I would guess. whatever the exchange rate is i'm not sure. it only had 1600 miles.
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Old 04-05-2004, 04:19 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Basically, FIII 600 = FIII 700. The 600 has the triple pipes, which makes about as much power as the 700 single pipe, but then the 600 has that extra 20 lbs. The 700 will be a little quicker off the line (single pipe = less weight, more torque). The 600 will probably have a bit more top speed (the 600's I have ridden make it to 110-115 mph on the speedo, the FIII700's get 105-110 mph.)

It seems easy around here to find any of the 1998 triples for sale. I see a bunch of 99's and 2000's on the trails, but don't see too many of them for sale. I have seen FIII 600's, 700's, and 800's around here for $2000 and up. Most of the ones in good-excellent condition w/ low miles are closer to $3000. (US dollars).

It should do OK in the trails. I would look for a ETS SC-10 kit if you get a CKIII with the SC-10. It "couples" the rear suspension. I have it on my sled and makes a big difference. Just do a lot of tweaking with the front and rear suspension, and you can get it to ride great. Get new rear springs for your body weight (odds are with a sled a few years old that it will need new springs anyways..).

As for what they will beat, it just depends on how well you have it setup.

My insurance agent won't touch anything over 700 cc's (State Farm). Luckily I just made it with 699.1 cc's with my 97 Mach 1. That includes 4 strokes. (contemplated a RX-1 last year..) I don't know if that's still the rule, but it was in '98 when I bought my sled.
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Old 05-02-2004, 05:24 PM   #10 (permalink)
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My 98 mach 1 had nothing go on it accept for the cdi box, other than that i love the sled.

it had problems this year with power but that was my fault, didnt clean my clutches and RAVE valves.

when i set up my clutches and cleaned out the rave it was a screamer.

i hit 120 on the speedo on a plowed road on a lake, about 1/4 from end to the other so take away some distance for slowing down i think it was pretty good.
Like 97 mach1 said it all depends how well its set up.

as far as handling its good as long as you keep the suspension stiff if you soften it to get it lower to the ground, it sucks it will roll and slide all over the place.

and whatever you do pick the crap out of the track 96 carbide picks aint gonna cut it i tried that and kick myself everyday. If your gonna use carbides put at least 144 GOOD carbides, but if your gonna ice race chisle picks.

the pipes triple pipes on the 98's put out more power but are a pain and have to be hot to make that power.
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