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Old 01-08-2013, 08:10 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meburdick View Post
If the trail runs by your property, you have a responsibility to mitigate risk from trespassers coming onto your property and getting hurt. You might have to install heavy duty fencing all along your property, for example, to ensure that the riders don't have an easy way onto your land. If you fail to do this, then yes, you could be held liable.
Well if this is the case you should'nt be bringing this up or the trail system is going to be in trouble. Every land owner in the state will fight you for the trail running past their land because fences are coming out not being built. This thought process is part of the problem with todays culture. Sue somebody because they have something and tempted me. Maybe the shoplifters can go after Wally World for having stuff to steal!!!
The funny thing about the law is that it is NOT black and white. Lawyers and insurance companies can and will distort things in whatever direction benefits them.
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Old 01-08-2013, 08:14 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Some how my post is in the middle of the quote.
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Old 01-08-2013, 08:23 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by zrt600800 View Post
The 2 sleds that hit the fence were riding off trail and in the farmers field, that is another reason to stay on the trail! If they were in the ditch where the trail was there would have been no problem, but people seem to always stray off and into the fields alot of times then tradgety strikes, damn shame this could have been avoided. Lets all stick to the trails and have some fun and pay attention!!!!!!!
They were in a field that the kids dad farmed.

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Old 01-08-2013, 10:33 AM   #14 (permalink)
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The guy that farms the land is not his dad, I know the guy who farms it. Just goes to show that if we have trails in the ditch in this state, we need more groomers to maintain these trails to keep the people in the ditch on a nice smooth trail. The groomers we have are stretched so far with the amount of miles of trail that they cant keep up, this damn extra money better go to getting more damn groomers and not just replacing the old ones all the time or going into somebodies fricken pockets and buddies of the issa. A great friend of mine got killed by a semi last weekend, its a damn shame that we even have to ride in the ditches here, just because there is a ditch doesn't mean there has to be a trail in it, lets get these trails out of the damn ditch. Yes i belong to a club, and yes the trails I maintain are 90% out of ditch. Just saddens me to no end when it hits this close to home as it did this weekend.
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Old 01-08-2013, 10:34 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Even worse should have known that the fences were there!
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:13 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I like ditch trails, smooth gets boring in a hurry. Hitting a fence is driver error, period. Hate to say that but riding in a field and not realizing were the fence or boundary is isn't anyone's fault but theirs. I have hit fences before cutting across a field, just scratches on the sled, nobodies fault but mine. Snowmobiling is a dangerous sport, if one doesn't have a sense of self preservation when riding any trail, ditch or field it is only a matter of time before you hit a pole, fence or culvert. In a low snow year like this seems to be the worst, I can't believe all the guys that go right up the center of field drives right over culverts. You have got to think every driveway or field has a culvert or fence and be on the lookout at all times.
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:22 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meburdick;6726763[B
]If the trail runs by your property, you have a responsibility to mitigate risk from trespassers coming onto your property and getting hurt.[/B] You might have to install heavy duty fencing all along your property, for example, to ensure that the riders don't have an easy way onto your land. If you fail to do this, then yes, you could be held liable.

The funny thing about the law is that it is NOT black and white. Lawyers and insurance companies can and will distort things in whatever direction benefits them.
That's the most asinine statement I have ever read (no offense to you meburdick). If someone is ignorant enough to go off the trail, and onto private property (let's say that property is signed with NO TRESPASSING! signs), then it's the offender's own damn fault for whatever happens to them. The fact this person died is sad. I'd rather see them total out their sled, walking away uninjured, and getting in trouble for trespassing
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:45 AM   #18 (permalink)
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That's the most asinine statement I have ever read (no offense to you meburdick). If someone is ignorant enough to go off the trail, and onto private property (let's say that property is signed with NO TRESPASSING! signs), then it's the offender's own damn fault for whatever happens to them. The fact this person died is sad. I'd rather see them total out their sled, walking away uninjured, and getting in trouble for trespassing
Unfortunately, what's asinine is that it's accurate. I don't agree with it, either, but that's how it is.

We live in a sue-happy world where too many people want to take someone else to court and claim that their losses are the result of another party. If you own land, you are liable for the things that may happen on that land, period. If you expect your insurance to COVER those liabilities, you must take adequate steps to ensure that you have done what is required. That may be as simple as "No Trespassing" signs. It may mean fences. It could be something else entirely.

Your insurance carrier has written clauses into your policies that specifically indemnify them from having to cover losses if necessary precautions weren't taken.

How would *I* like to see this handled? Well, here's my preferences:

- People ride responsibly, respecting other people's property and each other. Incidents are truly the result of "accidents."
- Any mis-haps leave riders with nothing more than a cuople of bumps and bruises, do no damage to anyone's property other than their own sled, and even that is minimal. Any occurrence is an isolated incident that results in the riders recalling "that was when I learned my lesson."

That's it. There's simply no need any stronger lessons. I wish that incidents would never result in severe injury or death, regardless of how/why they occurred.

BTW: I took no offense. I wasn't staying opinion... I was merely passing on what I've learned as a homeowner, policyholder, and employee of companies that deal with property loss.
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Old 01-08-2013, 02:36 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Please read Code of Iowa 321G.22 and 461C.

461C.3 Liability of owner limited.

Except as specifically recognized by or provided in section 461C.6, an owner of land owes no duty of care to keep the premises safe for entry or use by others for recreational purposes or urban deer control, or to give any warning of a dangerous condition, use, structure, or activity on such premises to persons entering for such purposes.

[C71, 73, 75, 77, 79, 81, 111C.3]

C93, 461C.3
2006 Acts, ch 1121, 4

Referred to in 461C.5


I own land next to a snowmobile trail in the ditch. I'm not worried.

Bottom line, ride at your own risk. Riding can be dangerous. Please be careful. Sad to hear about tragedies such as this.
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Old 01-08-2013, 02:51 PM   #20 (permalink)
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How does the states insurance cover instances like this for landowners if someone is "off trail" ie - off your groomed riding area , and someone gets hurt, is that the state? or your insurance? as sue happy as people are anymore Id be curious.
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