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Old 12-23-2009, 07:16 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Hi, i just noticed the wheels next to the rear wheels are loose on both sides. I can move them back and forth and they have alot of play. Are these called Idler wheels? I thought they should be like this being they are like this on both sides. They are the wheels in front of the rear wheel.
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Old 12-23-2009, 08:20 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Hi, i just noticed the wheels next to the rear wheels are loose on both sides. I can move them back and forth and they have alot of play. Are these called Idler wheels? I thought they should be like this being they are like this on both sides. They are the wheels in front of the rear wheel.[/b]
Just went through the same thing with my sled.

Yes. This is a sign that the bearings are failing. You have 2 choices.

1. Spend a lot of money and purchase all of the complete idler assembly's for about $25 a piece.
2. Buy the individual bearings for and the wheels and replace and reuses the actual wheel. Will be about $25.00 for all of the bearings.

You can purchase the bearings on Ebay for about $2.00 a piece. -

Here is the thread with all of the details

http://www.hardcoresledder.com/forums/inde...667&hl=6205
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Old 12-23-2009, 10:02 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Hey edski,

I have the exact sled. It sounds like it is time to pull the skid out and go through it. By "go through it" I mean the following:

- Check all the bearings on all the wheels in the skid - Mine has 11 or 12 total
- Check and lube all of the pivot points - there are grease fittings for most of them - make sure all pivots are easy to turn
- Check the hyfax - there is a line on outside of the hyfax that is a wear indicator - ~$20 for the pair
- Rebuild the shocks - The "SP" model has standard Fox Shocks - ~$25 each for oild change & recharge. Seals & "o" rings are cheap - If shaft is bad ~$35 per shock.
- Check for any cracks on the steel suspension assemblies. These can be welded up to repair.
- Before taking out the skid check the torsion (rear) springs for sacking. If the springs are set up to maximum and the suspension is still soft, time for new ones.
- Check that all the scissor stop blocks are not cracked and are free to move but have slight detents at each position. Also that the torsion spring blocks can rotate.
- Check the limiter straps that they are not severely cracked and the pairs are adjusted to the same position.
- Check and lube the threaded adjustments on the skid - Track tension and limiter straps. I put a little antiseize on these.

Also - the smaller wheels are NOT all the same diameter. The two that mount high on the skid that hold the torsion springs on are slightly larger than the other small wheels. These are 5.6" and the smaller ones are 5.35". The size is imprinted on the wheel iteself. Don't ask me why they did this but it is what it is.

I know this sounds like a can of worms but if you get everything set up and lubed you will be most happy!

Good luck!

Steve
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Old 12-23-2009, 10:27 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Hey edski,

I have the exact sled. It sounds like it is time to pull the skid out and go through it. By "go through it" I mean the following:

- Check all the bearings on all the wheels in the skid - Mine has 11 or 12 total
- Check and lube all of the pivot points - there are grease fittings for most of them - make sure all pivots are easy to turn
- Check the hyfax - there is a line on outside of the hyfax that is a wear indicator - ~$20 for the pair
- Rebuild the shocks - The "SP" model has standard Fox Shocks - ~$25 each for oild change & recharge. Seals & "o" rings are cheap - If shaft is bad ~$35 per shock.
- Check for any cracks on the steel suspension assemblies. These can be welded up to repair.
- Before taking out the skid check the torsion (rear) springs for sacking. If the springs are set up to maximum and the suspension is still soft, time for new ones.
- Check that all the scissor stop blocks are not cracked and are free to move but have slight detents at each position. Also that the torsion spring blocks can rotate.
- Check the limiter straps that they are not severely cracked and the pairs are adjusted to the same position.
- Check and lube the threaded adjustments on the skid - Track tension and limiter straps. I put a little antiseize on these.

Also - the smaller wheels are NOT all the same diameter. The two that mount high on the skid that hold the torsion springs on are slightly larger than the other small wheels. These are 5.6" and the smaller ones are 5.35". The size is imprinted on the wheel iteself. Don't ask me why they did this but it is what it is.

I know this sounds like a can of worms but if you get everything set up and lubed you will be most happy!

Good luck!

Steve [/b]

Exactly - I pulled the skid to do just the wheels and I ended up going through the whole skid. I ended up replacing a couple of cross shafts and some other items. Pulling the skid is the best way to get at all of the wheels any way.
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Old 12-27-2009, 12:51 PM   #5 (permalink)
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ok, i think i have an Xtra 12 suspension, it has 6 bogie wheels and 2 idler wheels??? Is this correct? Can i just buy 6 new bogie wheels for this, or should i just buy the bearings?
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Old 12-27-2009, 01:02 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Yours is a Special so yes it is the extra 12, just buy the bearings and replace them unless the wheel are damaged.
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Old 12-27-2009, 02:40 PM   #7 (permalink)
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so, when the bearings are bad the wheel will move side to side? Also, anyone know what size the bearings are? I don't have any paperwork or manual on hand. I guess i will order 6.

can't find any on ebay, where can i buy the kind i need?
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Old 12-27-2009, 03:59 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Current Sled(s): 09 Apex LTX 10 Vector LTX 96 500SKS
Previous Sled(s): 96Ultra 95XLTSP 72 440TNT 73 SW433 69 Panther 399
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13-14 Mileage: 2500
12-13 Mileage: 1595
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Hey edski,

I just finished doing my 95 XLT SP skid. Don't forget about the bearings on the 4 rearmost wheels that tension the track. There should be a total of 12 wheels to maintain.

There will a bit of side play on the bearing but the real check is for rough rotation and dry grease.

Fortunately all the bearings are the same: 6205 with rubber seals on both sides. These are easy to find and I would bet putting "6205" on eBay you will find some sources.

Replacing them is easy once the wheels have been removed. All you have to do is remove the big circlip holding the bearing in and take a closed end of a large socket and put it on the opposite side of the bearing, place the circlip side of the wheel on a couple of 2X4 scraps and whack away. The bearing should slide out and put the new one in in reverse. I recommend a soft hammer for both operations. Clean out the circlip groove and make sure the circlip is seated after putting it in. I take a channel locks and push the clip into the groove all the way. Look at one before removing the clip to see how the clip should set in the wheel.

If you are at all concerned about how the skid should go together once you get it apart, use your camera phone or a camera to take a picture as a guide.

Good Luck!

Steve
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Old 12-27-2009, 05:31 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Just finished doing my 95 skid as well, be sure you keep all your bushings from the shox with the shox!
I found out the hard way that not all the shock bushings front and rear are not the same length!!!
I had finished re-installing the rear skid and was in the process of installing my front shox when I realized the bushings were too long!!!!

Long story short, rear skid came back out, shox removed, and proper bushings for each shock had to be located!!

I had removed all the rubber grommets from the shox including the bolts & bushings because I was having them rebuilt (Fox gas) and figured it would be easier for the guy rebuilding them! WRONG, it wasn't necessary at all.

I also replaced all the wheel bearings while the skid was out, the bearings are KML's(Amcan up here) and were only $3.50 each (6205, most common bearing ever made)
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Old 12-28-2009, 04:43 PM   #10 (permalink)
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so, when the bearings are bad the wheel will move side to side? Also, anyone know what size the bearings are? I don't have any paperwork or manual on hand. I guess i will order 6.

can't find any on ebay, where can i buy the kind i need?[/b]
Hi edski
You should get yourself a manual if you're going to start doing work like this (pulling skid). When you put it back in you'll have to set it up properly which isn't a big deal but without a manual you won't know where to make track tensioning measurements and the like.
Good luck!
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